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Old 01-24-2009, 08:25 AM   #1
DZ
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Some good points mentioned in above posts. While a gamefish status in Mass may not make much difference in the "big picture" it would increase the numbers of surviving bass that call Mass waters home for much of the season. Just imagine how many pin hook boats pound Sow & Pigs and Gay Head during the season. Their take is a LOT of quality bass that, if there is no sale, will continue to populate local waters stabilizing the local population. Every bass that is not kept or sent to market is a bass that everyone has a chance of catching in the future. Of course every quality bass that is released increases the amount that a pin hooker can sell.

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Old 01-24-2009, 09:15 AM   #2
Slipknot
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Originally Posted by DZ View Post
Of course every quality bass that is released increases the amount that a pin hooker can sell.

DZ

ya DZ, I do think about that when I release a quality fish , say in the canal during comm season, and i kind of bums me out but then again that fish doesn't have any chance at all if I kept it or another rec. caught and kept it. I'll just keep releasing what I can and hope for the best.



Did clammer really write that?
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Old 01-24-2009, 11:15 AM   #3
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ya DZ, I do think about that when I release a quality fish , say in the canal during comm season, and i kind of bums me out but then again that fish doesn't have any chance at all if I kept it or another rec. caught and kept it. I'll just keep releasing what I can and hope for the best.
Did clammer really write that?
This follows with my earlier post in that it is hard to convince many recreational fisherman to release fish as long as there is a commercial fishery. If you stop commercial fishing it would be easier to convince people to release fish. Plus even more important it would be easier to put stricter catch limits on the recreational fisherman because you would be saving the fish for them.

I wonder if we learned anything from the past. If the numbers are even close to right we are killing bass at a higher rate then we were in the early 70s. Maine, NJ and NH do not allow commercial fishing, if a big user state like Mass stops it may really start the ball rolling. So don't under estimate what this may do.
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Old 01-24-2009, 12:01 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by MikeToole View Post
If the numbers are even close to right we are killing bass at a higher rate then we were in the early 70s. Maine, NJ and NH do not allow commercial fishing, if a big user state like Mass stops it may really start the ball rolling. So don't under estimate what this may do.
I don't feel like we are killing more now than back in the 70's. Back then everything was kept regardless of size becuase there were minimal, if any, regulations other than the 16" size limit.

The Mass commercial season is a joke to me not due to the amount thats harvested, but that its a free for all. The biggest issue for me is the ability for an out of stater to purchase a license and harvest the Mass quota. Its simply assinine as there is no reciprocal with other states that allow commercial harvest. I don't support full exclusivity on the license, meaning only "full time" commercials can or should harvest all the fish. The Mass resident taxpayers should reap the benefit of exclusivity versus allowing any other states to participate.

My personal take is there's still a lot of fish, although there may be fewer than 10 years ago following the moratorium. I don't fully buy the Myco epidemic either. I think its seemingly more prevalent because its being talked about more. I'm also basing my views on what I've experienced and I haven't seen many myco laced fish in my travels.

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Old 01-24-2009, 12:53 PM   #5
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I have seen em where I fish.The infected fish that is.They are nasty they run from a few sores to full on popcorn puss balls.
I have at times cut my line so's not to have to touch em.
Nasty stuff..
Even if you don't believe the stocks are in trouble.Why not err on the side of protecting the fish.??
It's the safe bet..

FORE!
It's usually darkest just before it turns Black..
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Old 01-24-2009, 01:02 PM   #6
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Your right .. anyone can get a Ma. commercial license / that why [I thnk} its in the neighborhood of 5000 of them .

In RI it is a very limited entry .. I believe there are 2 or 3 available for 2009 .
So the last few springs /when we have had alot of market size bass in the bay ......... guys that wanted in .were SOL >>. it least RI is very strick of issuing any kind of commerciL FISHING LICENSE . you can,t get a quohaug license or clam license either // again that fishery too will let a very few into that industry / soley based on the stock & license that didn,t renew for one reason or another .
Back when licenses were readly available / ..everyone had them Inculding out of start anglers // & there are still OOS anglers the fish RI commercially
When they put the freeze on the catching & keeping & selling of stripers . many of these people didn,t renew their licenses ... I can,t count the number of guys that are pissed they let thier licenses go ..
even many diggers / that,s a tough way to make a living & often when a guy has a opportunity to get a real job // they grabbed it ... then things went sour & they also are SOL .

We /the average guy doesn,t even know how many people actually sell fish .
the state does because we have log books that have to be filled out in detail on a daily basis & turned into the state quarterly ;
the reason being / the average commercial fisherman does n,t know .. if that @ one time RI issued a Multi-purpose license / which almost covered all kinds of commercial fisheries . This lincense is no longet available thru the state . The only way one of these can be transferred / if a fisherman has documated proof of so many landing in a certain period of time & he sells his whole business . his complete fishing rig // & even then the paperwork is passed thru the level in the dem & is approved by a high level offical '
getting back to the M/P licenses that are still active .. we don,t know how many are being used for what .. some may be being used for only one fishery / while others may being used in a few / I know alot of guys th a t have the M/P license that only are doing one fishery / but they were wise enough to keep paying the additional fee to keep the M/P ,,, that has always given them a option / Most of us way back used it for mainly digging & fishing / no clue now ;;


Slip >>>yA possed out of the plug forum

ENJOY WHAT YOU HAVE !!!

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Old 01-24-2009, 02:34 PM   #7
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Some of the same people who complain about taking 2 bass a day will take 2-3 dozen bunker or other baitfish per day and have no problem with it at all. I grew up catching bass with live pogies. Then they disappeared from our waters. As soon as they came back everyone hit them hard and acted like they discovered that live bait catches big bass. No kidding!! We all have look at life in the oceans differently than we once did. Protect it from the bottom up. You can,t have numbers of Stripers skyrocket while baitfish numbers drop. So protect the baitfish and where they live first. Otherwise it won,t work. IMO
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Old 01-24-2009, 02:23 PM   #8
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LOTS of GOOOOD points being stated here;

i firstly and foremostly have to agree with the Fixing of the Forage.

gamefish status seems, imho, to be a moot point if the increased #'s of stripers must work harder to locate their first choice and best nutritional value ~bunker, lb for lb~ bang for the buck that they have been foraging on for centuries. could the increase in the "racers" population be a result of myco bact. AND a decrease in READILY available menhaden???

i imagine this racer stock having to swim farther and farther and already low on nutrition from their nutriously deficient breeding grounds~~~~~~~~~then as they return to their migratory haunts, the same lack of menhaden than say X number of years ago, contributes to a "sickly" stock base that might be more susceptable to myco bacteriosis where they breed and less nourished when they return to the same menhaden depleted OBX. seems like a vicious, multiplying, and repeating cycle that has yet to reach it's MAX potential for disaster,,,,,,,,,,

i say that the Omega Proteins of the world need to diversify and find alternative sources for fish oil and they can plant soy beans for chicken feed!! why not farm the menhaden and leave the wild ones ALONE?? i'm no rocket scientist; but it seems to me that a soy bean field would be onehelluvalot cheaper to service and maintain than a fleet of purse seiners and their spotter planes~~ FOGEDDAH BOUT the indisputable damage that has been done to the Atlantic Coast Stock of Menhaden. human GREED knows no bounds and often will not stop until her obese adzzz is getting her stomach stapled with a fistful of oreos(bunker) in onehand, boatloads of CASH in the other, and her feet firmly planted on the necks of stripers,,,,,,,,,,,,,

on a another tine of this multi-pronged discussion,

while i am quite sure that Mister McKenna's anecdotal observations are very true and accurate,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,from my limited experience and in the "samplings" that i found from '08 i ran into schoolies first in the spring to june from DI to GLCSTR, then i had a better year than in '07 for keepers by size and pb and less racers than '06 and '07 combined. also, the Fall began with a run of schoolies after a great year of big fish up Cape Ann way, and i missed the blitzes due to mucho work. my numbers may be skewed and i fished much less than in '07, but i C&R many fish that covered the entire spectrum of sizes and what seems to be the "right" pattern of progression?? and for the first time in three years i ran into fall morning boos and a deep of the night beached fall inshore cod on the Other Cape in '08. what this ALL means, is for the marinebiologists, but from this layman's perspective seems "normal".

lastly, regarding the liscensing/slots/fisheries mngmnt debate,

i will say this,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,i will concurr with Bryan and others in that we need slots or 1@36"+ with just a coupla provisos. WHEN the feds/states enact this liscensing tariff, i hope and pray that the monies are targeted monies that will and MUST go back into research, enforcement, and parks and recreation.

notsomuch for me and my selfish desires to win back some of the shoreline from the bluebloods and their politicos, but in the interest of proferring the opportunity to pass-on the quintessential NE experience to the generations that will follow,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,our legacy must not only deal with the matters at hand ~~and they ARE multiple~~but we must also consider our children and our children's children.

certainly the Narragansetts from the 1200's - 1700's were responsible enough to ensure that their future peoples had stripers to eat, sell, trade. are we THAT much more shallow and THAT less considerate of one of God's greatest provisions (to include the oceans, the forage, and the species) that we could repeat the atrocities of 80's and the decimation of the American Bison?? both were proud species that flourished and were managed most effectively without phd's, science, mangmt councils, or a gov't that could care less about what's GOOD for its God given resources. these precious commodities were respected by a peoples that knew their intrinsic values for the GOOD of the whole planet and for the enrichment of their immediate, intermediate, and their lives ad infinitum.

i am fully aware that THESE are different times, but WHO
made them this different and at WHAT monumentous COSTS??
for once i would like to see the US of A proact instead of react,
since the latter is always too little too late and wreaks irrepairable
damage more often than NOT!!!

just sum thoughts,,,,,,,,,gents,,,,,,,,,,carry on!

"The first condition of happiness is that the connection
between man and nature shall not be broken."~~ Leo Tolstoy

Tight Lines, and
Happy Hunting to ALL!
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