Finally, an opponent takes the gloves off against Obama

[spence]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"He demonizes some. He panders to others. His campaign strategy is to smash America apart and then cobble together 51 percent of the pieces. If an American president wins that way, we all lose," Romney said.

Sounds exactly like the Karl Rove approach Bush used.

I think every presidential candidate would be guilty of demonization and pandering.

Obama certainly didn't smash America apart in 2008, hell, if anything he won by capturing the independent vote.

I could make a good argument even now that Romney is doing exactly as he just said.

That's why the quote doesn't have a lot of value outside of the haters.

-spence

[Nebe]

every election its the same thing. They work to discredit the other person and say very little about what THEY would actually do... I am getting so sick of this crap..

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Nebe

every election its the same thing. They work to discredit the other person and say very little about what THEY would actually do... I am getting so sick of this crap..

I'm kinda hoping for a third party, maybe call it the Common party as opposed to the Emperor's Red and Blue parties that have no clothes.

[likwid]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

I'm kinda hoping for a third party, maybe call it the Common party as opposed to the Emperor's Red and Blue parties that have no clothes.

The media (and the two parties) will make sure that never happens.
Polarizing people to one side or another is easier to sell to.

Most who try to run independent are marginalized (most for very good reason) and shunned by mass media and the two parties.

Unless someone can be produced who has a reasonable view (sorry, but nuking taxes and programs for this that and everything else will never fly) with reasonable cuts ACROSS the board (yes i mean everything tightening up the belt) it'll never happen.

As it is, the level of pandering you have to do to EVERY special/not special interest group prevents that.

[The Dad Fisherman]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

I'm kinda hoping for a third party, maybe call it the Common party as opposed to the Emperor's Red and Blue parties that have no clothes.

There is always the Libertarian party...Unfortunately the Christian Conservatives and the Social Democrats will make sure that never happens.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by spence

Obama certainly didn't smash America apart in 2008, hell, if anything he won by capturing the independent vote.

With promises of crossing the aisle and working closely with Democrats and Republicans alike. Then, he crapped all over the Independent vote by building a huge steel wall between himself and Republicans and by ignoring just about all moderate promises that he made.

[spence]

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

Then, he crapped all over the Independent vote by building a huge steel wall between himself and Republicans and by ignoring just about all moderate promises that he made.

I'll bet that's a lot easier to post than prove.

-spence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

I'll bet that's a lot easier to post than prove.

-spence

As for breaking promises, he promised to cut the deficit in half and to close Gitmo...

As for being divisive, he said that Republicans should sit in the back of the bus.

How's that for worlking across the aisle Spence? How will you spin that, I wonder?

A little modicum of intellectual honesty makes life a lot easier Spence.

[likwid]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

As for breaking promises, he promised to cut the deficit in half and to close Gitmo...

As for being divisive, he said that Republicans should sit in the back of the bus.

How's that for worlking across the aisle Spence? How will you spin that, I wonder?

A little modicum of intellectual honesty makes life a lot easier Spence.

We'll completely ignore the Defense Authorization Bill of 2011, it would be hard to build outrage and blame with that.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by likwid

We'll completely ignore the Defense Authorization Bill of 2011, it would be hard to build outrage and blame with that.

Likwid, I don't know what that bill is, I don't know what it did. Unless that bill closed Gitmo or made it illegal to insult Republicans, posting that bill does not refute my point.

Spence said it would be difficult to prove that Obama broke promises, and that it would be difficult to prove that Obama intentionally alienates his political opponents. He said that would be difficult. Turns out, it's only difficult when you are literally blinded by love for Obama.

As it turns out, if you consider Obama's record honestly and thoughtfully, you can prove those things in two seconds.

Did Obama break every promise he ever made? Nope. Does he insult conservatives every time he opens his mouth? Nope.

Did he break promises? Yes. Does he have a habit of demonizing those who disgree with him? Yes.

Nothing hateful or even opinionated in that post. Just fair-minded honest facts.

[likwid]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Likwid, I don't know what that bill is, I don't know what it did. Unless that bill closed Gitmo or made it illegal to insult Republicans, posting that bill does not refute my point.

Go look it up, please. Just spewing "look! didn't close gitmo!" without understanding the backstory is just straight up silly.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by likwid

We'll completely ignore the Defense Authorization Bill of 2011, it would be hard to build outrage and blame with that.

You mean a bill that was essentially dropping the Constitution into a fire? As a Constitutional Scholar, you'd think Obama would have vetoed the bill due to the blatant destruction of civil liberties that were contained within.

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by spence

Sounds exactly like the Karl Rove approach Bush used.

I think every presidential candidate would be guilty of demonization and pandering.

Obama certainly didn't smash America apart in 2008, hell, if anything he won by capturing the independent vote.

I could make a good argument even now that Romney is doing exactly as he just said.

That's why the quote doesn't have a lot of value outside of the haters.

-spence

to Paul and Spence - Thats just plain crap - talking points, but let me see some details. I can easily give you specific examples where Obama has said (my quotes may be slighly off) -
1. "These people cling to the their guns and religion" - while addressing San Francisco dems
2. "People say you should learn English, while I say maybe your kids should learn Spanish" while addressing a latino crowd
3. Countless times he demonized "wall st fat cats", banking, etc

Romney has been in the political limelight for over decade. Obama much less. Please provide examples of Romney insulting americans, demonizing people he doesnt agree with or contribution to dividing this country?
It speaks to class and character. Sorry, Obama does not rate highly in either category. I look forward to the details.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by spence

I think every presidential candidate would be guilty of demonization and pandering.

-spence

Ahhh. But Obama was the one who promised something called "change". HE was going to be a different (better) kind of politician. HE was going to end the partisan rhetoric and bring us all together. Since his entire campaign was based upon "change", I don't think it's a valid defense to say "everyone does it".

He promises to be different, people buy it, he turns out not to be different, , and no one holds him accountable for that.

And Spence, in the same thread here, yuo claimed that (1) you don't agree that Obama demonizes the opposition, and then (2) you defend it by saying everyone else does it.

Spence: Obama doesn't sling mud. And besides, it's OK when he does it, because everyone else does.