Why I Won't Vote For OBAMA

[Flaptail]

Seperation of church and state, isn't that called for in our constitution?

The Christian fundamentalist movement is a business, a money making machine, Creflo Dollar (I just luv that name) preaches that through his ministry and being born again it wil bring your prosperity thriough Christ in the form of spiritual healing and manifest itself into personal wealth meaning money and material things. It sure has worked for him, he lives in a multi million dollar home(s) and drives a couple Rolls-Royces, 1000 dollar suits and 12000 dollar watches.

Praise Jesus Y'all!!!!!'

If this country, as Jerry Falwell wanted is someday under the control of Born again Christian Fundamentalists then kiss free thought goodbye, kiss privacy and free speech goodbye, independent thought in based on scinece fact rather than religious science fiction.

If that happens I ahope I am either dead or able to leave, in sadness, what was once this great nation.

Christian fundamentalist takeover of the goverment is equal to what Osama Bin Laden and Al Qaida wnat for Saudi Arabia, Afgahnistan and other middle east countries.

The bible, though it has some good lessons on a few things is for the most part a fable, deived from some ancient text and perverted into what ever was needed and however it could be said to control large parts of a mostly uneducated population in the middle ages and since it worked then is still mostly unchanged since.

Feed then to the lions while it is not to late.

I know God, and this isn't the way he planned it.

[Nebe]

Originally Posted by Flaptail

If this country, as Jerry Falwell wanted is someday under the control of Born again Christian Fundamentalists then kiss free thought goodbye, kiss privacy and free speech goodbye, independent thought in based on scinece fact rather than religious science fiction.
.

Flap, what do you mean 'IF'? It is.

[scottw]

[QUOTE=Flaptail;631389]Seperation of church and state, isn't that called for in our constitution?

Really? can you show me exactly where this is stated in the Constitution? ...just wondering....

[RIROCKHOUND]

[QUOTE=scottw;631412]

Originally Posted by Flaptail

Seperation of church and state, isn't that called for in our constitution?

Really? can you show me exactly where this is stated in the Constitution? ...just wondering....

From Wikipedia (I know, but I dont have time to dig up a 'real' source)

So if it isn't in the consitution, it doesn't matter???
I agree Flap, while the 'Religious Right Moonbats' have a scary amount of increasing influence, if we ever get to that point, it will be a scary scary world. Like stepping back 50 years....


"Separation of church and state is a political and legal doctrine that government and religious institutions are to be kept separate and independent from each other.The term most often refers to the combination of two principles: secularity of government and freedom of religious exercise

The phrase separation of church and state is generally traced to the letter written by Thomas Jefferson in 1802 to the Danbury Baptists, in which he referred to the First Amendment to the United States Constitution as creating a "wall of separation" between church and state. The phrase was then quoted by the United States Supreme Court first in 1878, and then in a series of cases starting in 1948. This led to increased popular and political discussion of the concept."

[scottw]

[QUOTE=RIROCKHOUND;631416][QUOTE=scottw;631412]
From Wikipedia (I know, but I dont have time to dig up a 'real' source)

"THE REAL SOURCE"...LIKE THE ACTUAL CONSTITUTION???? HAAAAA


not good enough I'm afraid...not in the Constitution

In 1801 the Danbury Baptist Association of Danbury Connecticut had heard a rumor that the Congregationalist Denomination was about to become the established religion of the United States. Being concerned, as they should be, they wrote a letter to then President Thomas Jefferson on October 7th 1801.

On January 1st, 1802 Jefferson replied in a letter, which contained the following statement:

“American people which declared that their legislature should make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of separation between church and State”.

This letter is where the misrepresented idea of separation of church came from.

1811 – People vs. Ruggles

The Supreme Court Stated:

“Whatever strikes at the root of Christianity tends to manifestly to the dissolution of civil government.”

In 1853 a group filed a suit that actually wanted “Separation of Church and State”. The Case never made it to the Supreme Court.

On March 27, 1854 The House Judiciary Committee Stated:

“Had the people during the revolution had any suspicion of any attempt to war against Christianity, the revolution would have been strangled in its cradle.”

The Committee Continued…

“At the time of the adoption of the constitution and the amendments, the universal sentiment was the Christianity should be encouraged, but not any one sect.”

Also, it stated…

“In this age, there can be no substitute for Christianity. That was the religion of the founders of the Republic and they expected it to remain the religion of their descendants.”

Furthermore…

“The great vital and conservative element of our system is the belief of our people in the pure doctrines and the divine truths of the Gospel of Jesus Christ.” 1878 – Reynolds vs. United States

*****In this case the Supreme Court used Thomas Jefferson’s letter in its entirety. The letter was actually used to ensure Christian principals were kept in government.

this is fun....

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by Flaptail

Seperation of church and state, isn't that called for in our constitution?

The Christian fundamentalist movement is a business, a money making machine, Creflo Dollar (I just luv that name) preaches that through his ministry and being born again it wil bring your prosperity thriough Christ in the form of spiritual healing and manifest itself into personal wealth meaning money and material things. It sure has worked for him, he lives in a multi million dollar home(s) and drives a couple Rolls-Royces, 1000 dollar suits and 12000 dollar watches.

Praise Jesus Y'all!!!!!'

If this country, as Jerry Falwell wanted is someday under the control of Born again Christian Fundamentalists then kiss free thought goodbye, kiss privacy and free speech goodbye,
If that happens I ahope I am either dead or able to leave, in sadness, what was once this great nation.

Christian fundamentalist takeover of the goverment is equal to what Osama Bin Laden and Al Qaida wnat for Saudi Arabia, Afgahnistan and other middle east countries.

The bible, though it has some good lessons on a few things is for the most part a fable, deived from some ancient text and perverted into what ever was needed and however it could be said to control large parts of a mostly uneducated population in the middle ages and since it worked then is still mostly unchanged since.

Feed then to the lions while it is not to late.

I know God, and this isn't the way he planned it.

what does this have to do with the topic?
Again, I am not religious, but see how quickly a lefty (sorry flap) lashes out at religion? Its free thought as long as you agree with me.
"independent thought in based on scinece fact rather than religious science fiction"
see how you dismiss other peoples views as science fiction? So who is really the threat to free thinking? Fundamentalists or Liberals?

[scottw]

“The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.”
–Norman Thomas in 1969, former U.S. Socialist Party Presidential Candidate

[EarnedStripes44]

Originally Posted by scottw

“The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But, under the name of ‘liberalism’, they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.”
–Norman Thomas in 1969, former U.S. Socialist Party Presidential Candidate

Or rather as Bush has put it "to save the free market" and "ease the credit freeze".

[The Dad Fisherman]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

what does this have to do with the topic?

This whole thread is about letting Religion dictate who you vote for......

[scottw]

you are assuming that religeon dictates who people vote for and that's quite a leap....if you are Catholic, Jew, Black Liberation Theologist, Tree Worshiper and you vote the right way...OBAMA....everything is cool...but if you vote the wrong way...NOT OBAMA...then you are a religeous zealot and you only vote the way that your religeous leaders tell you to and probably based on abortion....oh, and you are a RACIST...huh?

Catholics and Jews are probably split pretty evenly between candidates, in fact Obama was leading among Catholics according to a poll yesterday(need to run some more infanticide commercials)...Obama has locked up the BLT's the Tree Worshipers and the Radical Muslims as well....oh, and the God/Jesus Deniers.....

[The Dad Fisherman]

Originally Posted by scottw

you are assuming that religeon dictates who people vote for and that's quite a leap.....

What Leap??? This is exactly what was posted in the 1st post of the thread.

Originally Posted by LT. DAN 2

Why a Christian Can Not Vote for Obama

The below was written by Huntley Brown and I agree with many parts (but not all) of his point of view.......and yes Spence I am affected by some subjects I read especially in the religious realm..

Huntley Brown is a fabulous concert pianist, man of God and is a black man.



Why I Can't Vote For Obama

By Huntley Brown

Dear Friends,

First I must say whoever wins the election will have my prayer support. Obama needs to be commended for his accomplishments but I need to explain why I will not be voting for him.

Many of my friends process their identity through their blackness.

I process my identity through Christ. Being a Christian (a Christ follower) means He leads I follow. I can't dictate the terms He does because He is the leader.

I can't vote black because I am black, I have to vote Christian because that's who I am. Christian first, black second. Neither should anyone from the other ethnic groups vote because of ethnicity. 200 years from now I won't be asked if I was black or white. I will be asked if I knew Jesus and accepted Him as Lord and Savior.

I'm pretty sure the whole basis of this post...and Thread is about basing your decision on your religious beliefs.

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

What Leap??? This is exactly what was posted in the 1st post of the thread.
I'm pretty sure the whole basis of this post...and Thread is about basing your decision on your religious beliefs.

That and exit poll data in 2004 that showed more people voted for GWB b/c of 'Moral Issues', (specifically abortion and gay marriage) then for terrorism, war in Iraq etc...
If it dictates it at all, it is too much!

[scottw]

Originally Posted by RIROCKHOUND

That and exit poll data in 2004 that showed more people voted for GWB b/c of 'Moral Issues', (specifically abortion and gay marriage) then for terrorism, war in Iraq etc...
If it dictates it at all, it is too much!

that's great...you have the 2004 exit polls right at your disposal but can't locate the 1st Ammendment to the Constitution haaaa
let me help you:
Congress shall make no Law respecting and establishment of Religeon or Prohibiting the free exercise thereof....

I think Obamaism is clearly a religeon that the socialist/marxist left would like to establish through the Congress and a clear affront to our Constitution and it's First Ammendment

I hate it when people get involved or vote in "Moral Issues", there's way too much morality around these days....

[scottw]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

What Leap??? This is exactly what was posted in the 1st post of the thread.


I'm pretty sure the whole basis of this post...and Thread is about basing your decision on your religious beliefs.

no, you assume that he can't vote for Obama because his religeon but in fact he won't vote Obama because of his "value system" which happens to be Christian in it's roots and a large part of who he is...

WHAT IS YOUR VALUE SYSTEM???
can you define it or do you just play it by ear...

I don't oppose abortion or gay marraige because my "religeon" instructs me to...I oppose them because I believe that they are wrong regardless of religeous influences....

Are you like Nebe and think noone should tell anyone else what to do or how to live their lives...talk about juvenile...a functional society dictates that this be done to some extent, the argument is all about where the lines should be drawn on various issues...much easier to tell those that disagree with you to keep their values to themselves than to have to debate the merits of your own....

this is the game that the secular left plays with the whole "Separation" thing....you need to leave your religeon at the voting booth door and therefore in many cases your value system out of your voting decisions???

Your secular value system is somehow more legitimate than my Christian based value system??? Oh, that's right...you use your brain and I don't think, I just do what I'm directed to do my my "religeon"....

I sit a few feet away from our Senate Majority Leader at church each week, we are not likely to agree on many issues and vote very differently in the voting booth and I assume we both vote based on what we deeply believe however different, the fact that we both vote in opposite directions tells me that our "religeon" has not dictated our decisions...I can't ever remember our Church giving any voting instructions.....but I bet Obama's church is giving plenty....

the left would say that our esteemed SML did not bring their "Religeon" into the voting booth and that I in turn did....this allows them to delegitimize my vote in their minds....sneer and look down their noses at those that they perceive as voting strictly as they are instructed to by their "religeon"....


DAD....."and I bet if I went to my Priest and said I voted for somebody that supported abortion and wanted to be excommunicated.....he'd try his best to talk me out of it.

This whole thread is about letting Religion dictate who you vote for"......


if you approach your Pastor and stick out your tongue and tell him you voted for someone that supports infanticide and want to be excommunicated...you very well might get excommunicated...
if you are honestly seeking forgiveness or counsel...you'll probably get that as well.....


lot's of religeous bigots out there...

[Nebe]

scott.. could you please describe the GOP value system over the past 8 years please?

help me out here because if you think that the GOP has a value system that is worth voting for, then I am missing something

Unbelievable.