It's time to..........

[Flaptail]

Originally Posted by basswipe

You need to go fishing because you're struggling real hard to comprehend what I'm getting at here chief. I'm tryin' to help you out.So one more time......

You can't make statements supporting,even in joking,the non-accidental death of the president.Why?Because you'll end up in the clink and what good can become of that?I'll tell you...not much.

Why would I say that?Read my previous posts.I don't like the guy.I'm so tired of death and destruction it makes me sick.And yet it would never occur to me to wish death upon the president.Isn't there enough death already,why keep adding to it?

As far as running for president...no thanks.With people like you out there I wouldn't even take the chance as I like being alive and able to fish.

Basswipe, I do understand. I guess my frustration at seeing Americans in this sort of predicament is just so hard for me to comprehend. I know I would never really advocate the "taking out" of this guy but right now I cannot see how we as a country, as Americans can abide the incompetence any longer. That guy Brown, the head of FEMA, has had no prior experience in emergency response. He was the head for twelve years of the Arabian Horse Breeders and judges Association and only got the job because he was a college roomate of one of George Bush's campaign advisors. There are no words to describe how dis=heartening that is to me.

I feel sorry in a way for President Bush. Here was a guy who ran on his fathers name and won (?) out of total chaos with the current electoral system and who should have been in for only 4 years in a nondescript presidency. Along comes 9-11. Now he is thrust into a global and political situation that he was neither equipped or prepared for as someone who has the leadership capabilities or the knowledge of current world politics to handle. He just does not have the inteligence, on a personal level, or wisdom for the world arena, maybe business wise on a more local level but not as a world leader or diplomat.

I really do think with him and the current situation at hand that administration that now sits in residence in Washington needs to be removed before his term is over. Impeachment is called for, now, immediately. An unprecidented house cleaning of the presidency, vice presedency. Defense , State and Homeland Security and Fema shoul be immediatly removed and an interim govt. be installed. I knoww the chos that would create. American doller values would crash, the stock market would respond wildly but also the world opinion of what we would have done would also look more favorably on us. We must close our borders and look internally for a period. We must let the world know that we have to attend to our immediate family before we can participate in the global family, which after our house cleaning and our American family healing we will once again become partners with the world as a whole. We have to look to ourselves. To the goal of racial equality, raise the bar to commom standards for every American. Healthcare, decent housing, jobs need to be brought back home from overseas. Corporate greed needs to be curbed. Should the CEO of Levi's really get a 22 million dollar bonus for closing down the last three North American plants and sending them to Asia and latin America with the result of 3000 plus workers getting the pink slip?

It's time for a change before we go down as the romans, the greeks the egyptians and all the great civilization before us did. America was and is still a great experiment who is being watched by the world. The signs are there that we may have reached our Zenith and be headed on the downward side of our flight. We can recover but we need to change things and do it as soon as possible our collective futures and our childrens hang on the very prospect.

[BigFish]

I think the US Government really showed the world their a$$ on this one!

[Mike P]

Steve--you can't impeach a President for incompetence. The Constitution makes it pretty clear---only for "high crimes and misdemeanors" committed while in office.

I think Bush should have asked his old man why Saddam was allowed to stay in power after the first Iraq war, too, before starting up with this one. And maybe listened to his dad more than he listened to guys like Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz. I blame Rumsfeld most of all for what has happened over there. It was his bright idea that the job could be done with a quarter of the troops we used in '91, and that we'd be welcomed with flowers and open arms as liberators

[Flaptail]

Originally Posted by Mike P

Steve--you can't impeach a President for incompetence. The Constitution makes it pretty clear---only for "high crimes and misdemeanors" committed while in office.

I think Bush should have asked his old man why Saddam was allowed to stay in power after the first Iraq war, too, before starting up with this one. And maybe listened to his dad more than he listened to guys like Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz. I blame Rumsfeld most of all for what has happened over there. It was his bright idea that the job could be done with a quarter of the troops we used in '91, and that we'd be welcomed with flowers and open arms as liberators

Mike, what was the impetus to remove Andrew Johnson after Lincoln was assinated? Wasn't it because he was incompetent? I don't really remember but I thought tht was it. Can a vote of no confidence be had if the commander and chief shows himself to be just that? It would be interesting to know. Can you shed some light on that aspect? Thanks.

[Flaptail]

Sorry typed too fast Lincoln wasn't "assinated" ( maybe in the political cartoons of the time) but assasinated. Sorry carry on.

[Mike P]

Andrew Johnson was impeached on what were basically trumped-up charges. He was, first of all, a Democrat and replaced Lincoln's first term VP, Hannibal Hamblin, to create sort of a "unity" ticket during the Civil War. Secondly, he was a Southerner, from Tennessee. That made him hugely unpopular with the so-called "Radical Republicans" who wanted to punish the Confederacy during Reconstruction. And, they did everything they could to undermine his power.

What led to Johnson's impeachment and trial was that Congress enacted a law (that was probably unconstitutional to begin with) prohibiting the President from firing Caninet and other high level officers without the approval of the Senate, which was solidly controlled by the Republicans. Johnson defied the law and went ahead and fired an official who he felt wasn't following his administration's agenda. He broke the law, so it was easy to claim that he committed a "high crime" or at least a "misdemeanor". He was impeached by the Hosue, but was acquitted at his Senate trial by a single vote. He got to stay on as President but he was really powerless after that.

"No confidence" votes do exist in other democracies that have a Parliamentary system, where the Prime Minister or Premier is the leader of the party that controls the lower house of the Legislature. Not sure on this, but I don't believe they have scheduled elections like we do. A certain percentage of the Legislature can ask for elections or pass a "no confidence" resolution, and the citizens go to the polls shortly thereafter.

[Pete_G]

Originally Posted by Flaptail

It's time for a change before we go down as the romans, the greeks the egyptians and all the great civilization before us did. America was and is still a great experiment who is being watched by the world. The signs are there that we may have reached our Zenith and be headed on the downward side of our flight. We can recover but we need to change things and do it as soon as possible our collective futures and our childrens hang on the very prospect.

I'd been afraid to say it (here anyways) but that's kind of how I feel about the country right now.

We need great leaders to make this country great again or we'll fall like our predecessors.