Thoughts and Prayers

[Pete F.]

COVID arrived in the US on January 13. Wednesday is May 13.

That’s four months. Four months to figure things out, to communicate a plan, & to get testing & tracing in place. Instead, it seems we’re just opening up because of politics. Trump* the leader completely failed this test.

No, it would not be perfect. Just like any war there would need to be adjustments to the plan and targets would change.
But far better than baloney, miracles and magic drug gaslighting.

Just the minimal effort to demonstrate CDC recommendations at his task force propaganda meetings and the WH would have made a significant difference in infections and spread.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

COVID arrived in the US on January 13. Wednesday is May 13.

That’s four months. Four months to figure things out, to communicate a plan, & to get testing & tracing in place. Instead, it seems we’re just opening up because of politics. Trump* the leader completely failed this test.

No, it would not be perfect. Just like any war there would need to be adjustments to the plan and targets would change.
But far better than baloney, miracles and magic drug gaslighting.

Just the minimal effort to demonstrate CDC recommendations at his task force propaganda meetings and the WH would have made a significant difference in infections and spread.

You want to say our testing has been a flop, I agree.

But once it's "here", I'm not sure what the president can reasonably do, to stop it and keep unemployment from surging. I guess Obama would have gone out, barechested with bullets strapped across his chest and a cigar in his mouth, and beat the virus back singe-handedly.

Trump was wrong for trying to curtail it with a travel ban, That was unnecessary because the virus wasn't that serious. Now, it's awful and he didn't do enough.

That's a textbook case of trying to have it both ways.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

You want to say our testing has been a flop, I agree.

But once it's "here", I'm not sure what the president can reasonably do, to stop it and keep unemployment from surging. I guess Obama would have gone out, barechested with bullets strapped across his chest and a cigar in his mouth, and beat the virus back singe-handedly.

Trump was wrong for trying to curtail it with a travel ban, That was unnecessary because the virus wasn't that serious. Now, it's awful and he didn't do enough.

That's a textbook case of trying to have it both ways.

Show me where I ever said a travel ban was bad, it is simply typical Trump* gaslighting. I've always said what he did was misdirected effort, not enough and just typical Trump* baloney based on his "gut" or "points to head".
He has set himself and us up perfectly to fail by ignoring the experts, not pushing for the funding and not enabling the staff and mechanisms that were in place to excel.
The nation that produced 8 fighters an hour in WW2, couldn't produce tests, swabs or masks to meet the need.
Yes, it is this administrations fault.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention on Jan. 21 announced the first travel-related case of novel coronavirus in the United States. Trump* made his administration's restrictions effective Feb. 2. (On Jan. 17, the CDC had begun health screenings of passengers on direct or connecting flights from Wuhan, China, the epicenter of the outbreak.)

Trump* barred non-U.S. citizens from traveling from China, but there were 11 exceptions, and Hong Kong, Macao and Taiwan were not included. U.S. citizens and permanent residents could still travel from China but were subject to screening and possible 14-day quarantine. Some flights were immediately suspended, but others continued for weeks, at the discretion of the airlines.

“All of the evidence we have indicates that travel restrictions and quarantines directed at individual countries are unlikely to keep the virus out of our borders,” said Jennifer Nuzzo, from Johns Hopkins University’s Center for Health Security, at a congressional hearing Feb. 5. She was not alone in saying this.

Screening and testing did not function and social distancing that has never been taken seriously by the WH was too little too late, so we are now at 1.4 million infected and 80 thousand dead.

It's far from over.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Show me where I ever said a travel ban was bad, it is simply typical Trump* gaslighting. I've always said what he did was misdirected effort, not enough and just typical Trump* baloney based on his "gut" or "points to head".
He has set himself and us up perfectly to fail by ignoring the experts, not pushing for the funding and not enabling the staff and mechanisms that were in place to excel.
The nation that produced 8 fighters an hour in WW2, couldn't produce tests, swabs or masks to meet the need.
Yes, it is this administrations fault.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention on Jan. 21 announced the first travel-related case of novel coronavirus in the United States. Trump* made his administration's restrictions effective Feb. 2. (On Jan. 17, the CDC had begun health screenings of passengers on direct or connecting flights from Wuhan, China, the epicenter of the outbreak.)

Trump* barred non-U.S. citizens from traveling from China, but there were 11 exceptions, and Hong Kong, Macao and Taiwan were not included. U.S. citizens and permanent residents could still travel from China but were subject to screening and possible 14-day quarantine. Some flights were immediately suspended, but others continued for weeks, at the discretion of the airlines.

“All of the evidence we have indicates that travel restrictions and quarantines directed at individual countries are unlikely to keep the virus out of our borders,” said Jennifer Nuzzo, from Johns Hopkins University’s Center for Health Security, at a congressional hearing Feb. 5. She was not alone in saying this.

Screening and testing did not function and social distancing that has never been taken seriously by the WH was too little too late, so we are now at 1.4 million infected and 80 thousand dead.

It's far from over.

I never said, that you claimed the travel ban was bad. I said the media, and many prominent democrats, said it was unnecessary because the virus wasn't that dangerous.

Now they are shifting the goalposts.

Because what matters isn't the truth, what matters is orangemanbad.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

I never said, that you claimed the travel ban was bad. I said the media, and many prominent democrats, said it was unnecessary because the virus wasn't that dangerous.

Now they are shifting the goalposts.

Because what matters isn't the truth, what matters is orangemanbad.

the media, and many prominent democrats, said it was unnecessary because the virus wasn't that dangerous.

I think your fingers are outrunning your brain again

Was that Hannity?
And what democrats?

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

the media, and many prominent democrats, said it was unnecessary because the virus wasn't that dangerous.

I think your fingers are outrunning your brain again

Was that Hannity?
And what democrats?

"Was that Hannity?"

I never watch Hannity. He's a clown. I could argue that you are exactly as clownish, you are just the mirror image. To Hannity, the republican is always right, no exceptions. To you, the republican is always wrong, no exceptions. Neither one of you is to be taken seriously.


"And what democrats?"

Not sure how you can be sufficiently ignorant to not be aware of this.

Here, Biden, Sanders, and media outlets are quoted...

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/dem...ina-travel-ban

Here's another itemized list...

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fro...vent-aged-well

"I think your fingers are outrunning your brain again"

No, just outrunning your brain. Not a high bar.

Now you go ahead and tell me that Trump was the only one who got it wrong. Yet a Gallup poll shows that 60% of Americans approve of the way he's handling it.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"Was that Hannity?"

I never watch Hannity. He's a clown. I could argue that you are exactly as clownish, you are just the mirror image. To Hannity, the republican is always right, no exceptions. To you, the republican is always wrong, no exceptions. Neither one of you is to be taken seriously.


"And what democrats?"

Not sure how you can be sufficiently ignorant to not be aware of this.

Here, Biden, Sanders, and media outlets are quoted...

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/dem...ina-travel-ban

Here's another itemized list...

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fro...vent-aged-well

"I think your fingers are outrunning your brain again"

No, just outrunning your brain. Not a high bar.

Now you go ahead and tell me that Trump was the only one who got it wrong. Yet a Gallup poll shows that 60% of Americans approve of the way he's handling it.

As I expected you quote Faux news article that rely on partial quotes.
Here is Biden's OpEd from January 31, 2020.
Quite far from what you claim, the rest of the Faux quotes are similar.

Joe Biden: Trump is worst possible leader to deal with coronavirus outbreak
President has blithely tweeted that 'it will all work out well.' Yet the steps he has taken have only weakened our capacity to respond.
Joe Biden Opinion contributor January 31, 2020

The possibility of a pandemic is a challenge Donald Trump is unqualified to handle as president. I remember how Trump sought to stoke fear and stigma during the 2014 Ebola epidemic. He called President Barack Obama a “dope” and “incompetent” and railed against the evidence-based response our administration put in place — which quelled the crisis and saved hundreds of thousands of lives — in favor of reactionary travel bans that would only have made things worse. He advocated abandoning exposed and infected American citizens rather than bringing them home for treatment.

Trump’s demonstrated failures of judgment and his repeated rejection of science make him the worst possible person to lead our country through a global health challenge.

The outbreak of a new coronavirus, which has already infected more than 2,700 people and killed over 80 in China, will get worse before it gets better. Cases have been confirmed in a dozen countries, with at least five in the United States. There will likely be more.

Diseases don't stop at borders or walls
The State Department has scheduled an evacuation flight and advised Americans against traveling to Hubei province, the epicenter of the outbreak, and is evacuating non-essential personnel.

Trump has blithely tweeted that “it will all work out well.” Yet the steps he has taken as president have only weakened our capacity to respond.

Trump has rolled back much of the progress President Obama and I made to strengthen global health security. He proposed draconian cuts to the National Institutes of Health (NIH), the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and the Agency for International Development — the very agencies we need to fight this outbreak and prevent future ones.

He dismissed the top White House official in charge of global health security and dismantled the entire team. And he has treated with utmost contempt institutions that facilitate international cooperation, thus undermining the global efforts that keep us safe from pandemics and biological attacks.

To be blunt, I am concerned that the Trump administration’s shortsighted policies have left us unprepared for a dangerous epidemic that will come sooner or later.

Pandemic diseases are a prime example of why international cooperation is a requirement of leadership in 2020. Diseases do not stop at borders. They cannot be thwarted by building a wall. We cannot keep ourselves safe without helping to keep others safe as well and without enlisting the help of other nations in return. And here’s the truth — the United States must step forward to lead these efforts, because no other nation has the resources, the reach or the relationships to marshal an effective international response.

That’s how we broke the infection curve on Ebola. In September 2014, CDC projections warned that over 1 million people could be infected if we failed to act. By February 2015, thanks to the leadership of our administration, the number of new Ebola cases was fewer than 400. A few months later, the epidemic was essentially extinguished.

I will uphold science, not fiction or fear
We brought the world together behind a response that only the United States could mobilize — including dispatching our military on a limited mission to help build the urgent infrastructure necessary to coordinate a massive global public health response, deploying American disaster assistance response teams to Africa, unleashing the NIH to help spur the discovery of new treatments and vaccines, protecting our citizens from potential cases of Ebola in the USA, and harnessing civilian expertise from the CDC at home and abroad.

We acted over the chorus of uninformed objections from critics like Donald Trump, and more than 60 countries followed our lead, contributing over $2 billion, thousands of health professionals and personnel, and other critical resources like personal protective equipment. Just as important, we strengthened our focus on preparing for the next crisis.

That’s the kind of leadership a moment like this demands — a leadership Trump could never deliver.

As president, I will reassert U.S. leadership in global health security. My policies will always uphold science, not fiction or fearmongering. I will ask Congress to beef up the Public Health Emergency Fund and give me the power to use the Stafford Disaster Relief and Emergency Assistance Act to declare a disaster if an infectious disease threat merits it.

I will also renew funding — set to expire in May — for the nationwide network of hospitals that can isolate and treat people with infectious diseases, and fully fund the Global Health Security Agenda so the world is ready for the next outbreak. And I will rebuild public trust, make sure we have dedicated resources to help us respond to crises quickly, and better harness the capabilities of the private sector to protect the American people. Our national security requires nothing less.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

I never said, that you claimed the travel ban was bad. I said the media, and many prominent democrats, said it was unnecessary because the virus wasn't that dangerous.

Now they are shifting the goalposts.

Because what matters isn't the truth, what matters is orangemanbad.

the media, and many prominent democrats, said it was unnecessary because the virus wasn't that dangerous.

I think your fingers are outrunning your brain again

Was that Hannity?
And what democrats?

Cite some evidence or just admit the truth