| |
 |
|
|
|
 |
|
 |
| |
| Political Threads This section is for Political Threads - Enter at your own risk. If you say you don't want to see what someone posts - don't read it :hihi: |
06-29-2012, 12:24 PM
|
#1
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Rockland, MA
Posts: 651
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
06-29-2012, 12:41 PM
|
#2
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,481
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by sokinwet
|
Quite interesting...
Good to see Jim has made another massive miscalculation in just the span of one week! 
-spence |
|
|
|
|
|
|
06-29-2012, 01:43 PM
|
#3
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,441
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
Quite interesting...
Good to see Jim has made another massive miscalculation in just the span of one week!
-spence |
Spence, I see you still have your habit of logging on, hurling an insult with no support, and scurrying off.
Spence, read my post. I didn't offer a single syllable about Fast & Furious. I made a few points in my original post...
(1) the dems walked out of the Holder contempt vote
(2) walking away when things aren't going your way, seems childish
(3) influential liberals have suggested that the GOP is going after because he is black, despite the fact that some blacks voted to hold him in contempt
(4) influential liberals have asuggested this is a partisan witch hunt, despite the fact that 15+ Democrats voted to hold Holder in contempt
Spence, where in those points did I make a "massive miscalculation"? Please be specific, so that I can benefit from your thoughtful and learned commentary.
Last edited by Jim in CT; 06-29-2012 at 02:15 PM..
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
06-29-2012, 04:11 PM
|
#4
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,481
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
Spence, where in those points did I make a "massive miscalculation"? Please be specific, so that I can benefit from your thoughtful and learned commentary.
|
You're making a gross generalization not backed by reality Republicans have in fact walked out on votes in protest many times over similar contempt charges.
A quick Google and it looks like they did it several times in 2008 alone, choosing partisan politics instead of representing their constituents as they were elected to do.
Shameful.
People have been saying this has been a witch hunt and if the CNN piece rings true that might just be the case.
As for scurrying off, that also is not backed by facts. I had to get some work done, sweat a little (nobody saw me) and get my older son from camp. It was a lucid experience if anything...not at all a scurry.
-spence |
|
|
|
|
|
|
06-29-2012, 04:21 PM
|
#5
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,441
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence
People have been saying this has been a witch hunt and if the CNN piece rings true that might just be the case.
As for scurrying off, that also is not backed by facts. I had to get some work done, sweat a little (nobody saw me) and get my older son from camp. It was a lucid experience if anything...not at all a scurry.
-spence
|
"People have been saying this has been a witch hunt and if the CNN piece rings true that might just be the case."
Wrong. The Holder contempt vote has nothing to do with the subject matter in the CNN article. The contempt hearings have to do wih (1) the possibility that Holder lied under oath, and (2) Congress' request for documents that reveal who knew what, and when. This would all have been avoided if Holder and Obama handed over the documents. They didn't. That doesn't sound like the "transparency" that a certain megalomaniac presidential candidate promised.
"As for scurrying off, that also is not backed by facts."
It's not? You said a made a huge mistake, but offered not one syllable to support that. You still haven't. As usual.
Spence, does your side NEVER get tired of labeling everyone who disagrees with them about anything, as a racist? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
06-29-2012, 03:36 PM
|
#6
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Bethany CT
Posts: 2,885
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by sokinwet
|
Just another example of the cons distorting reality for political gains. Get people fired up. The masses won't take a second look to find out the truth. Pathetic. |
No, no, no. we’re 30… 30, three zero.
|
|
|
|
|
06-29-2012, 04:05 PM
|
#7
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by zimmy
Just another example of the cons distorting reality for political gains. Get people fired up. The masses won't take a second look to find out the truth. Pathetic.
|
you constantly talk about "people" or "the masses" as though you somehow reside above them when it come to intellect and understanding...
Sen. Grassely's response:
June 28, 2012
Fortune magazine piece on Fast and Furious
M E M O R A N D U M
To: Reporters and Editors
Re: Fortune magazine piece on Fast and Furious
Da: Thursday, June 28, 2012
The Fortune magazine piece on Operation Fast and Furious is problematic in several respects. Sen. Chuck Grassley began investigating the circumstances of the death of border patrol agent Brian Terry 18 months ago after whistleblowers came to him with concerns. The following statement is from Grassley’s office. Supporting documents are available here.
“The Fortune piece conspicuously ignores the most important fact in this case: ATF encouraged cooperating dealers to sell guns to known traffickers. That fact is key to understanding how ATF made a strategic choice to track the guns instead of stop them. The central claim of the article, that there was nothing ATF could have done to stop the illegal sales, is simply incompatible with the evidence. If it is true that ATF could not interdict and seize weapons due to legal hurdles beyond its control, then ATF had no business telling gun dealers to go ahead with the sales.
“The Fortune article asks the reader to believe that sworn statements by whistleblowers who put their careers on the line to expose the truth for Brian Terry’s family are merely conspiratorial fabrications for the sole purpose of getting back at their boss. It asks the reader to believe that the ATF Director, the Attorney General, the White House, and Congress all fell victim to the fabrication and completely misinterpreted or misunderstood the thousands of pages of documents that corroborate the whistleblower allegations. The Justice Department retracted its previous denials of those allegations last December 2. If the Fortune article is accurate, the Justice Department’s December 2 retraction would itself be a false capitulation under political pressure aimed at protecting senior DOJ officials at the expense of ATF field office personnel in Arizona.
“The Fortune article inexplicably credits the self-serving statements of the supervisors in Arizona responsible for overseeing Fast and Furious. There is no explanation as to why, given their obvious motive to claim there was no gun-walking to save themselves from criticism and punishment. That’s why the written records, the interviews on the record, and obtaining and weighing all evidence is so important. We can only draw fair, informed conclusions from the facts.” |
|
|
|
|
|
|
07-02-2012, 11:28 AM
|
#8
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Mansfield, MA
Posts: 5,238
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by sokinwet
|
There's so much more than is reported in that one fortune article. In a title wave of misconduct, the article does nothing but grasp at straws to help save face for Holder and the Obama administration.
Fortune's "investigation" is quickly made inaccurate by the number of firearm sellers that tried not to sell guns to people because they were obvious straw purchases. Specifically, I remember reading about a .50 cal rifle that a dealer didn't want to sell but was encouraged by the ATF to allow the sale to go through.
Here's one specific gun store owner speaking out:
Fast and Furious: Gun store owner opens up - latimes.com
Quote:
|
In the fall of 2009, ATF agents installed a secret phone line and hidden cameras in a ceiling panel and wall at Andre Howard's Lone Wolf gun store. They gave him one basic instruction: Sell guns to every illegal purchaser who walks through the door.
|
Quote:
|
When Howard heard nothing about any arrests, he questioned the agents. Keep selling, they told him. So hundreds of thousands of dollars more in weapons, including .50-caliber sniper rifles, walked out of the front door of his store in a Glendale, Ariz., strip mall.
|
So, we have multiple accounts of ATF wrong-doing, a gun store owner speaking out about being pushed by the ATF to allow straw purchases, the Dept. of Justice hiding behind the sham that is Executive Privilege and refusing to release all the documents, and not to mention a Border Patrol Agent killed by one of the very guns the ATF allowed to be illegally sold.... But, one cover-up article in Fortune invalidates all of that? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
07-02-2012, 11:54 AM
|
#9
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,441
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyD
But, one cover-up article in Fortune invalidates all of that?
|
Yes, unless you are a racist... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
07-02-2012, 12:26 PM
|
#10
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,306
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim in CT
Yes, unless you are a racist...
|
I'd guess you'd know a racist, right? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
07-02-2012, 12:40 PM
|
#11
|
|
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 20,441
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS
I'd guess you'd know a racist, right?
|
In accordance with TDF's request, I shall refrain from responding in kind. You have revealed much of yourself with that statement...
Last edited by Jim in CT; 07-02-2012 at 12:47 PM..
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Thread Tools |
|
|
| Display Modes |
Rate This Thread |
 Hybrid Mode
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:52 AM.
|
| |
