Fox tell Trump to arm Teachers - Page 4 - Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating

wdmso · 02-24-2018, 04:24 PM

It's not bad logic that says it's a bad idea to arm teachers it's actual data that makes the suggestion . And even trained officers have their challenges. Linear, thinking needs to change

The FBI’s analysis of active shooters between 2000 and 2013 has another relevant data point: “Law enforcement suffered casualties in 21 (46.7%) of the 45 incidents where they engaged the shooter to end the threat.” These are people trained to do this kind of thing full time, and nearly half were wounded or killed.

spence · 02-24-2018, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wdmso

It's not bad logic that says it's a bad idea to arm teachers it's actual data that makes the suggestion . And even trained officers have their challenges. Linear, thinking needs to change

I read that the NYPD did a study and found even their own officers only hit their targets 18% of the time during real incidents.

Sea Dangles · 02-25-2018, 12:18 AM

Can we at least agree that a shooter would target a gun free zone before a school that chose to have armed defense?
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spence · 02-25-2018, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Can we at least agree that a shooter would target a gun free zone before a school that chose to have armed defense?
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I don't think it matters at all. Mass shooters seem to pick their targets because of an emotional connection not because it seems easier. Additionally gun free zones don't mean their are no guns...there are plenty of exemptions.
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scottw · 02-25-2018, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence

Additionally gun free zones don't mean their are no guns...

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brilliant

spence · 02-26-2018, 08:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottw

brilliant

I guess you've never read the legislation.

Sea Dangles · 02-25-2018, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence

I don't think it matters at all. Mass shooters seem to pick their targets because of an emotional connection not because it seems easier. Additionally gun free zones don't mean their are no guns...there are plenty of exemptions.
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If you don't think it matters at all then why would you suggest police at schools as an improvement on keeping schools safe? Aren't you contradicting yourself?
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spence · 02-25-2018, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

If you don't think it matters at all then why would you suggest police at schools as an improvement on keeping schools safe? Aren't you contradicting yourself?
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Ive never said police at schools wouldn't help. I said in this one instance the officer couldn't go in. Doesn't mean his behavior wasn't an outlier.

The point being, if a trained officer can fail how would you expect a teacher to respond.
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scottw · 02-25-2018, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence

Ive never said police at schools wouldn't help. I said in this one instance the officer wouldn't go in. Doesn't mean his behavior was typical.

The point being, if a trained officer can fail how would you expect a trained teacher to respond.
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fixed it... and...

you are suggesting a trained teacher would turtle like this officer...and you don't know that....

Sea Dangles · 02-25-2018, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence

Ive never said police at schools wouldn't help. I said in this one instance the officer couldn't go in. Doesn't mean his behavior wasn't an outlier.

The point being, if a trained officer can fail how would you expect a teacher to respond.
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Jeff, you can not fail at something you never tried to do. Don't be so hard on yourself.

When you said"I don't think it matters at all" and then said "I've never said police at schools wouldn't help" that is contradicting yourself. Just saying.
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wdmso · 02-25-2018, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Can we at least agree that a shooter would target a gun free zone before a school that chose to have armed defense?
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Gun free zone have very little to do with how theses people plan their attacks, that's more speculation from the gun lobby .. they are not rational people . I suggest he was familiar with the school and they expelled him and how he gained access he fit in he used the same thing when he left most kill out of anger and they possibility of death isn't a much of a factor

It will be interesting once the investigation concludes how much was planned and how much was spontaneous . Seeing he's sadly alive to talk to investigators.

Sea Dangles · 02-25-2018, 10:47 AM

Jim, they don't want the government involved in saying who gets to own guns. Period,end of story.
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Jim in CT · 02-25-2018, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Jim, they don't want the government involved in saying who gets to own guns. Period,end of story.
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Maybe they are worse than I thought. Hard to contemplate...but it appears you were correct as usual, I'm sorry to say.

Sea Dangles · 02-25-2018, 11:00 AM

I am a member.
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Nebe · 02-25-2018, 12:14 PM

Dangles- the NRA most certainly wants everyone to have a gun.
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Sea Dangles · 02-25-2018, 02:00 PM

That is not true Nebe.
They just go overboard enforcing your constitutional rights. Self serving but their mission is definitely not to put a firearm in the hands of every citizen.
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Nebe · 02-25-2018, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

That is not true Nebe.
They just go overboard enforcing your constitutional rights. Self serving but their mission is definitely not to put a firearm in the hands of every citizen.
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You are correct. After some thought, the NRA wants everyone over 18 to be able to freely purchase a firearm. They don’t think everyone needs one.
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Sea Dangles · 02-25-2018, 02:18 PM

Thanks for clearing up your words Jeff.
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Sea Dangles · 02-25-2018, 09:31 PM

Zimmy, any idea why 5 years after Sandy Hook this was still just an idea? That's right,5 years and even the mighty Obama was still spinning the wheels.
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zimmy · 02-25-2018, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Zimmy, any idea why 5 years after Sandy Hook this was still just an idea? That's right,5 years and even the mighty Obama was still spinning the wheels.
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I think you might be able to look that up yourself. It wasn't "just an idea" it was set to take effect. But you are able to read and writes so you should be able to find out the date it was enacted and maybe even why there was a time period before implementation.

But as far as spinning wheels, he issued 23 executive orders related to gun control and school safety in January 2013.

On the law making side, he called on Congress to pass laws that would: require background checks on all gun sales; restore a ban on "military-style assault weapons"; ban gun magazines with capacities of more than 10 rounds; and toughen penalties on people who sell guns to those who can't have them.

What do you think Bird Sht-Traffic Cone-Comrade will have put together in the next month? Probably not much more than some tweets misquoting his Faux News teachers.

zimmy · 02-25-2018, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

That's right,5 years and even the mighty Obama was still spinning the wheels.
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Again, this isn't rocket science to figure out, but this is relevant to why take-all-your-guns-away-do-nothing(?) Obama was spinning his wheels:

"April 17, 2013
President Obama’s ambitious effort to overhaul the nation’s gun laws in response to December’s school massacre in Connecticut suffered a resounding defeat Wednesday, when every major proposal he championed fell apart on the Senate floor."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.5549decd1035

Sea Dangles · 02-25-2018, 10:20 PM

Thank you for making my point. There have not been many advances made in gun control for a long time. So you probably understand that it is not easy by this point. Obama was forced to make reactionary attempts to appease the nation and came out swinging. Trump will do the same and get criticized for getting nothing done.
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spence · 02-26-2018, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Thank you for making my point. There have not been many advances made in gun control for a long time. So you probably understand that it is not easy by this point. Obama was forced to make reactionary attempts to appease the nation and came out swinging. Trump will do the same and get criticized for getting nothing done.
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You have to choose your battles. Nothing is going to get done unless the Dem's take total control or a lot of Republicans rise above the NRA.

Trump will support a few token actions and then claim he tried. The NRA's actions could very well be self defeating.

Sea Dangles · 02-26-2018, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spence

You have to choose your battles. Nothing is going to get done unless the Dem's take total control or a lot of Republicans rise above the NRA.

Trump will support a few token actions and then claim he tried. The NRA's actions could very well be self defeating.

Hold your breath and count backwards from 100
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spence · 02-26-2018, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Hold your breath and count backwards from 100
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Quite lucid and relaxed here. I'll put on another pot for tea if it will make you feel good.

zimmy · 02-25-2018, 10:42 PM

That was your point? I like that you said appease the nation. Republicans stopped everything in its tracks even if it was overwhelmingly supported by the nation. Why? They are afraid of the NimRod Association. Pretty sure if the Dems controlled the congress in 2013, Obama would have gotten most of what he called for. Trump has mentioned background checks, age limits for "assault rifles", arming teachers. He will get dem support on two out of three, though dems want no more AR's sold. Guessing once La Pierre gets a hold of Trump, he will get nothing done and you will be right. I will certainly criticize him if that happens.

Sea Dangles · 02-26-2018, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zimmy

That was your point? I like that you said appease the nation. Republicans stopped everything in its tracks even if it was overwhelmingly supported by the nation. Why? They are afraid of the NimRod Association. Pretty sure if the Dems controlled the congress in 2013, Obama would have gotten most of what he called for. Trump has mentioned background checks, age limits for "assault rifles", arming teachers. He will get dem support on two out of three, though dems want no more AR's sold. Guessing once La Pierre gets a hold of Trump, he will get nothing done and you will be right. I will certainly criticize him if that happens.

Bold statement Zimmy. You really go out on a limb with your revisionist history. Too bad the dems didn't control congress. Those pesky checks and balances in our constitution reared their ugly head again.
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zimmy · 02-26-2018, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Bold statement Zimmy. You really go out on a limb with your revisionist history. Too bad the dems didn't control congress. Those pesky checks and balances in our constitution reared their ugly head again.
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Oh, the dems controlled congress in 2013? If that is the case, I am confused about history.

The Dad Fisherman · 02-26-2018, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zimmy

Oh, the dems controlled congress in 2013? If that is the case, I am confused about history.

Are you talking Senate or House of Representatives?
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Jim in CT · 02-26-2018, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

Bold statement Zimmy. You really go out on a limb with your revisionist history. Too bad the dems didn't control congress. Those pesky checks and balances in our constitution reared their ugly head again.
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They did control congress (both houses), for Obama's first two years. For a good chunk of that time they had a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate. I don't think the GOP could have stopped them from doing a thing. Yet they didn't.

Lots of blame here, both parties, the NRA, law enforcement, lots of blame...