a professional environmentalists take on Hunter Biden laptop

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Did you believe, or think, or feel, that Hunters laptop content was Russian disinformation when the media cited intelligence sources that made it appear that it was?

Hunters laptop content was Russian disinformation Makes some sense haven’t seen anything yet to disprove that possibility

There’s no intelligence source who specifically said the laptop was Russian disinformation.

The memo to all social media companies was look out for the possibility of Russian disinformation

Still waiting on what you feel is on the hard drive and what will it prove

You should read the article I linked
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Hunters laptop content was Russian disinformation Makes some sense haven’t seen anything yet to disprove that possibility

Why does it make sense if there is no proof that it is? And several of its emails have been verified by forensic experts. And early on, the DOJ said it was not Russian Disinformation.

There’s no intelligence source who specifically said the laptop was Russian disinformation.

I didn't say Intel specifically said it was, but that it characterized it as such, i.e. had all the earmarks of Russian disinformation. Which effectively cripples it--actually serves to "debunk" it in the eyes of many.

he memo to all social media companies was look out for the possibility of Russian disinformation

And it was known by those who wrote the memo that the laptop story was about to be broken, so the news media, and social media were primed by them to view it as Russian disinformation. And so treated it as such, either debunking it or suppressing it. The release of the Twitter files has shown how it was primed to block it.

Still waiting on what you feel is on the hard drive and what will it prove

I have no feelings about what is on the Hard drive. I was not even disgusted with the supposedly disturbing photos on it.

You should read the article I linked
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I did. It stated that several of the emails were verified, and some, including banking transactions and connection with Ukraine corruption.

But my question to you, was what did you believe, think, or feel about the story when it was characterized by various intel people and your favorite, or preferred media, as Russian disinformation. What effect, at the time when that happened did it have on your view of the story?

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

I did. It stated that several of the emails were verified, and some, including banking transactions and connection with Ukraine corruption.

But my question to you, was what did you believe, think, or feel about the story when it was characterized by various intel people and your favorite, or preferred media, as Russian disinformation. What effect, at the time when that happened did it have on your view of the story?

And it was known by those who wrote the memo

Did that conclusion come with a roll of tinfoil ? Because we know it’s not based on evidence

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Hunters laptop content was Russian disinformation Makes some sense haven’t seen anything yet to disprove that possibility

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how about the fact that today, twitter and facebook and cbs have all said it’s a legit laptop? Is the FBI claiming that the laptop is in any way, a product of russian disinformation? is anyone other than you, still making that claim?

wayne, have you seen any evidence to support the idea that it’s russian disinformation?

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

how about the fact that today, twitter and facebook and cbs have all said it’s a legit laptop? Is the FBI claiming that the laptop is in any way, a product of russian disinformation? is anyone other than you, still making that claim?

wayne, have you seen any evidence to support the idea that it’s russian disinformation?

Guessed you missed the whole part that laptop hard drives can be removed and replaced

[wdmso]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...-big-megaphone

How a Hunter Biden conspiracy theory grew, from lone tweet to a big megaphone
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Back in 1787, when the Constitutional Convention was drafting the part of the Constitution that would soon become the presidential pardon power, Mason unequivocally opposed the provision. The president, he said, “ought not to have the power of pardoning, because he may frequently pardon crimes which were advised by himself. It may happen, at some future day, that he will establish a monarchy, and destroy the republic. If he has the power of granting pardons before indictment, or conviction, may he not stop inquiry and prevent detection?”

Manafort and Flynn were indicted, one was convicted.
Plenty of inquiry was made about them and the charges against them.

But that’s about it. Everything else about these pardons, including the incentive they give the president’s allies to withhold evidence of criminality, is, unfortunately, within the anticipated scope of the pardon power. Indeed, the Constitutional Convention, having heard and rejected Mason’s prediction, can reasonably be said to have accepted the possibility of pardon abuse as the collateral cost of having a pardon power in the first place.

And why exactly would the delegates have done that? Why did they disregard Mason’s prediction? In the end, his concerns were rejected by his fellow convention delegates because, in their judgment, there were adequate remedies for that type of presidential misbehavior. As James Madison put it: “There is one security in this case [of misused pardons] to which the gentlemen [i.e., Mason and his supporters] not have adverted: If the President be connected, in any suspicious manner, with any person, and there be grounds to believe he will shelter him [with a pardon], the House of Representatives can impeach him; they can remove him if found guilty.”


And there you have it. George Mason was prescient. James Madison—tragically, it turns out—was naive. The most insidious damage to American norms from Trump’s pardon extravaganza stems not from the extravaganza itself, though that is bad enough. Rather the damage to our democracy comes, most clearly, from the supine, almost sycophantic nature of Congress’s response to the Trump presidency since the start, both with regard to his abuse of the pardon power and his excesses more generally.

As was done with Presidents before Trump, like Clinton, for instance. Actually Trump was investigated by a not "supine" or "sycophantic" Congress, but by an energetic, determined, and politicized Congress, more than Clinton was, or more than many if not most Presidents.

Madison saw Congress as a powerful guard dog capable of preventing executive misconduct. Instead, in terms of pardon abuse, as with so many other instances of Trump’s overreach, it has proved little more than a lapdog.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/ar...-start/617397/
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Here we go with Pete's every now and then nod to the Constitution when he thinks it suits his purpose. What a crock. He advocates censorship of speech, getting rid of the electoral college, prefers federal policies that usurp the constitutional power of the states, prefers centralized government over localized government, is in favor of ideologies such as Progressivism, CRT, various Postmodernist concepts, that are antithetical to the Constitution.

He is not really a friend of the Constitution, unless he thinks he can squeeze something out of it that can put some narrative of his in a favorable light.

Progressivism has been the real and constant force that has gutted much of the Constitution, and has transformed much of the rest by its Progressive notions on how it is to be interpreted. And the Progressives have openly stated that it is not a functioning guide for our modern society, and, indeed, should entirely, or mostly be scrapped.

This all has been going on well before Trump. It may be convenient to vilify and destroy him as the villain that has destroyed the Constitution and the Congress. But that is absurd. The Progressve Congresses, and Presidents, and Judges were responsible for that, not Trump, regardless of what you think of him as a person.

And your response that "hence," the fact that the DOJ did not find that Mueller's 10 points of possible Trump obstruction were sufficient to violate obstruction statutes, was not the reason why Trump pardoned Manafort and Flynn. There were actually strong cases, especially for Flynn, to be made for the pardons. Not the least of which that they, especially Flynn, were implicated by a wrongful attempt to bring down the President.

And those attempts to bring down the President were as harmful to "our democracy" as what you want to blame Trump for.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Here we go with Pete's every now and then nod to the Constitution when he thinks it suits his purpose. What a crock. He advocates censorship of speech, getting rid of the electoral college, prefers federal policies that usurp the constitutional power of the states, prefers centralized government over localized government, is in favor of ideologies such as Progressivism, CRT, various Postmodernist concepts, that are antithetical to the Constitution.

He is not really a friend of the Constitution, unless he thinks he can squeeze something out of it that can put some narrative of his in a favorable light.

Progressivism has been the real and constant force that has gutted much of the Constitution, and has transformed much of the rest by its Progressive notions on how it is to be interpreted. And the Progressives have openly stated that it is not a functioning guide for our modern society, and, indeed, should entirely, or mostly be scrapped.

This all has been going on well before Trump. It may be convenient to vilify and destroy him as the villain that has destroyed the Constitution and the Congress. But that is absurd. The Progressve Congresses, and Presidents, and Judges were responsible for that, not Trump, regardless of what you think of him as a person.

And your response that "hence," the fact that the DOJ did not find that Mueller's 10 points of possible Trump obstruction were sufficient to violate obstruction statutes, was not the reason why Trump pardoned Manafort and Flynn. There were actually strong cases, especially for Flynn, to be made for the pardons. Not the least of which that they, especially Flynn, were implicated by a wrongful attempt to bring down the President.

And those attempts to bring down the President were as harmful to "our democracy" as what you want to blame Trump for.

So Trump’s a Stable Genius and a constitutionalist…

Now tell me why Manafort was pardoned.
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

So Trump’s a Stable Genius and a constitutionalist…

Now tell me why Manafort was pardoned.
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Because, as you say, Trump is a Stable Genius. If that's not good enough for you, some would say that google is your friend. You might want to try a variety of right leaning sources as well as the lefties.

And I'm not your puppet dancing to the tune of your every demand.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Because, as you say, Trump is a Stable Genius. If that's not good enough for you, some would say that google is your friend. You might want to try a variety of right leaning sources as well as the lefties.

And I'm not your puppet dancing to the tune of your every demand.

But Putin had puppets

Senior FBI official who led 2016 investigation finding no link between Trump and Russia, Charles McGonigal, has now been arrested for taking and laundering money for Russian oligarch Oleg Deripaska.
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[Pete F.]

Deripaska was indicted last year and is being tried for a number of federal crimes.

Paul Manafort, Trump's 2016 campaign manager, also worked for Deripaska and then laundered the money, getting convicted -- before Trump pardoned him.
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[detbuch]

Look out! Pete is now on a roll. He has totally taken over the thread, totally hijacked it. Expect more and more and more and more . . . He's flooding the zone with his prized little bits of one-sided old news . . . he can't be stopped . . . He's like a high speed train run amuck . . . no! he is like a John the Baptist in the desert and in the wilderness of the ignorant . . . educating us about Putin's puppets . . . about Deripaska . . . about Russian oligarchs . . . and Trump and Russia . . . in case we haven't heard the good news . . . we will be cleansed . . . and saved . . . in the baptismal waters of Pete the political baptist . . . get on your knees and thank the leftist heaven that he will not stop until Trump is crucified!

[Rmarsh]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Look out! Pete is now on a roll. He has totally taken over the thread, totally hijacked it. Expect more and more and more and more . . . He's flooding the zone with his prized little bits of one-sided old news . . . he can't be stopped . . . He's like a high speed train run amuck . . . no! he is like a John the Baptist in the desert and in the wilderness of the ignorant . . . educating us about Putin's puppets . . . about Deripaska . . . about Russian oligarchs . . . and Trump and Russia . . . in case we haven't heard the good news . . . we will be cleansed . . . and saved . . . in the baptismal waters of Pete the political baptist . . . get on your knees and thank the leftist heaven that he will not stop until Trump is crucified!

He has been promising us this for years

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Rmarsh

He has been promising us this for years

DOJ: 4 Oath Keepers Convicted of Seditious Conspiracy for Jan. 6

Nothing happens overnight your hero might still get his jump suit
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[Rmarsh]

Originally Posted by wdmso

DOJ: 4 Oath Keepers Convicted of Seditious Conspiracy for Jan. 6

Nothing happens overnight your hero might still get his jump suit
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Not my hero....I just like seeing justice applied equally.....keep making assumptions ....it is fitting.

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Rmarsh

Not my hero....I just like seeing justice applied equally.....keep making assumptions ....it is fitting.

What do you mean by "applied equally"?

He already has been fined $Ms for his crimes.

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Rmarsh

Not my hero....I just like seeing justice applied equally.....keep making assumptions ....it is fitting.

Justice being applied equally is another right wing talking point.

Justice has never been applied equally because all cases aren’t equal..

Ya ok he’s not your hero.

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Look out! Pete is now on a roll. He has totally taken over the thread, totally hijacked it. Expect more and more and more and more . . . He's flooding the zone with his prized little bits of one-sided old news . . . he can't be stopped . . . He's like a high speed train run amuck . . . no! he is like a John the Baptist in the desert and in the wilderness of the ignorant . . . educating us about Putin's puppets . . . about Deripaska . . . about Russian oligarchs . . . and Trump and Russia . . . in case we haven't heard the good news . . . we will be cleansed . . . and saved . . . in the baptismal waters of Pete the political baptist . . . get on your knees and thank the leftist heaven that he will not stop until Trump is crucified!

with his prized little bits of one-sided old news . .

Spoken like a true cult member
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

with his prized little bits of one-sided old news . .

Spoken like a true cult member
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My "cult"?? is better than yours.

[Pete F.]

Florida man is #^&#^&#^&#^&ting his pants about Special Counsel Jack Smith's work.

At 1 am, Trump ranted on "Truth social": "My Special Counsel (“PROSECUTOR”) is viciously harassing and bullying anyone and everyone in sight."
Trump’s scared, as he should be.
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Florida man is #^&#^&#^&#^&ting his pants about Special Counsel Jack Smith's work.

At 1 am, Trump ranted on "Truth social": "My Special Counsel (“PROSECUTOR”) is viciously harassing and bullying anyone and everyone in sight."
Trump’s scared, as he should be.
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Propaganda Pete tells us that Trump is scared. The cult of Propaganda Pete is scary.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Propaganda Pete tells us that Trump is scared. The cult of Propaganda Pete is scary.

Right out of Goebbels Nazi's propaganda playbook.

Accuse the other of that which you are guilty.
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Right out of Goebbels Nazi's propaganda playbook.

Accuse the other of that which you are guilty.
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That's what you just did. (I back up my claim, as in post #110 in the Rons at it again thread.) And then you did it again in post #111 of that same thread.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by detbuch

That's what you just did. (I back up my claim, as in post #110 in the Rons at it again thread.) And then you did it again in post #111 of that same thread.

Sure, as long as guns are unlimited, history is defined how you want, you define voting, they make books criminal, the only relationship that’s allowed to be read about is between a man and a woman and you’re not woke because reading, science and empathy are bad.
It’s easier to figure out once you realize that woke is a stand-in for the N word.
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

A teacher giving a child a book determined by the state to be inappropriate is a class 3 felony in Floriduh under DeFascist.
You think any lawyer would recommend that teachers provide any books to children?
Classroom libraries have been one of the effective aids developed to increase literacy.

But I spout propaganda

Yes you do. Because you said that this was under your notion of part of an entire Republican agenda. Different states have different policies. States run by Republican agendas do not all have the same policies. But you generalize a specific example to falsely paint a picture of being an "entire" agenda.

Here you give a broad brush example of a specific which is supposed to categorize an overall picture. You paint a singular hypothetical that is supposed to cover the entire range of the Republican agenda in the domain of books in school libraries.

As far as I know, Florida does not, in general, felonize giving an inappropriate book to a child. But in a Florida Public School classroom, the material must be, “free of pornography” and “appropriate for the age level and group.” Public schools throughout the nation have traditionally done this sort of thing. Who decides that is determined by district school boards. Florida House Bill 1467 makes what materials are being used and what are being considered for purchase far more transparent to the public and allows more public input. A major objection to it from the left is that it is an "extreme, developmentally inappropriate, and often outright harmful level of parental control over access to information". So who's freedom are we talking about here? The Freedom of the citizens, or the power of the bureaucracy? The bill empowers the citizens over the "system."

Allowing the people to have a say is not fascist. Telling the people to shut up and take it is.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Yes you do. Because you said that this was under your notion of part of an entire Republican agenda. Different states have different policies. States run by Republican agendas do not all have the same policies. But you generalize a specific example to falsely paint a picture of being an "entire" agenda.

Here you give a broad brush example of a specific which is supposed to categorize an overall picture. You paint a singular hypothetical that is supposed to cover the entire range of the Republican agenda in the domain of books in school libraries.

As far as I know, Florida does not, in general, felonize giving an inappropriate book to a child. But in a Florida Public School classroom, the material must be, “free of pornography” and “appropriate for the age level and group.” Public schools throughout the nation have traditionally done this sort of thing. Who decides that is determined by district school boards. Florida House Bill 1467 makes what materials are being used and what are being considered for purchase far more transparent to the public and allows more public input. A major objection to it from the left is that it is an "extreme, developmentally inappropriate, and often outright harmful level of parental control over access to information". So who's freedom are we talking about here? The Freedom of the citizens, or the power of the bureaucracy? The bill empowers the citizens over the "system."

Allowing the people to have a say is not fascist. Telling the people to shut up and take it is.

It’s a class 3 felony for a teacher to give a “bad” book to a child, not a hypothesis.

ALEC currently has the same legislation in every Republican legislative body in the country.
Claiming it’s different in every one is baloney, the same people are funding and writing the bills nationwide.

Just what did Ron DeFascist tell Disney?
You think other weaker businesses didn’t see that?
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[wdmso]

The American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) is a nonprofit organization of conservative state legislators and private sector representatives who draft and share model legislation for distribution among state governments in the United States

ALEC has produced model bills on a broad range of issues, such as reducing regulation and individual and corporate taxation, combating illegal immigration, loosening environmental regulations, tightening voter identification rules, weakening labor unions, and opposing gun control.[8][9][10][11] Some of these bills dominate legislative agendas in states

But they have No agenda lol
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

It’s a class 3 felony for a teacher to give a “bad” book to a child, not a hypothesis.

In the context of your "Why does the entire Republican agenda involve stopping, limiting, or taking away something," it creates a hypothetical notion that it is part of the "entire" Republican agenda. And you give an abbreviated description that sounds so horrible. But it is not. Public schools have always had standards to be met. States mandate that your children must attend a school, and what must be taught. And what is not allowed. Not abiding by policy has always had severe punishments. Usually being fired or suspended. That is not particularly a Republican agenda. Nor does "the entire Republican agenda involve stopping, limiting, or taking away something". That's pure propaganda.

You think any lawyer would recommend that teachers provide any books to children?

A lawyer would recommend books that the school boards allow, and not recommend books that were against school policy. At least for schoolroom use. Outside of the school, acting as a private citizen, not a public school teacher, I expect that the teacher would have wider latitude.

Classroom libraries have been one of the effective aids developed to increase literacy.

And they still will be, even in Florida. The Bible would be an effective aid to increase literacy. I don't think Dems want to allow the Bible in public classroom libraries.

ALEC currently has the same legislation in every Republican legislative body in the country.

ALEC does not legislate. It recommends, influences, just as other nonprofits, like Planned Parenthood and the Health industries, etc. But the legislatures have to choose to adopt the various models, or parts of them, or versions that suit their constituency, and then create a bill to be voted on by the public. State legislators are not experts on every subject. Many are fairly stupid, actually. They get lots of advice from all manner of lobbyists and organizations. So the politicians pick and choose what they want to support (or are paid to support) or what they think can get them elected depending on the nature of their constituents. So, no, not every Republican state has the same laws, just as not all the Democrat states do either.

Claiming it’s different in every one is baloney, the same people are funding and writing the bills nationwide.

Not true. Not at the state level.

Just what did Ron DeFascist tell Disney?
You think other weaker businesses didn’t see that?

Actually, Disney had a fascist agreement with the State of Florida which gave Disney a sweet tax deal and Disney could basically regulate its own conduct in Disneyland. Desantis stopped that but not until June, by which time a new fascist deal can be hammered out.

And weaker companies didn't have that kind of fascist deal to risk. And, c'mon man, you don't think weaker companies fear their governments' intrusion into their viability if they don't tow the ruling political party's line? Look what's happening with the insertion of diversity, equality, and inclusion training in all manner of businesses.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Actually, Disney had a fascist agreement with the State of Florida which gave Disney a sweet tax deal and Disney could basically regulate its own conduct in Disneyland. Desantis stopped that but not until June, by which time a new fascist deal can be hammered out.

And weaker companies didn't have that kind of fascist deal to risk. And, c'mon man, you don't think weaker companies fear their governments' intrusion into their viability if they don't tow the ruling political party's line. Look what' happening with the insertion of diversity, equality, and inclusion training in all manner of businesses.

So Disney’s deal was fascist, now fascism is providing services to your own business at your cost while the state doesn’t pay. DeFascist found out that his tantrum was going to cost Floridians a fortune and tucked his tail between his legs and ran.

Tell us “what' happening with the insertion of diversity, equality, and inclusion training in all manner of businesses.”
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[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Actually, Disney had a fascist agreement with the State of Florida which gave Disney a sweet tax deal and Disney could basically regulate its own conduct in Disneyland. Desantis stopped that but not until June, by which time a new fascist deal can be hammered out.

And weaker companies didn't have that kind of fascist deal to risk. And, c'mon man, you don't think weaker companies fear their governments' intrusion into their viability if they don't tow the ruling political party's line? Look what's happening with the insertion of diversity, equality, and inclusion training in all manner of businesses.

The Villages have the same agreement . But their considered conservative . so their to be ignored

the real fascists calling others Fascists classic