Trayvon

[RIJIMMY]

this little tidbit aint getting a lot of attention from the media...

“You will recall the incident of the beating of the black homeless man Sherman Ware on December 4, 2010 by the son of a Sanford police officer. The beating sparked outrage in the community but there were very few that stepped up to do anything about it. I would presume the inaction was because of the fact that he was homeless not because he was black. Do you know the individual who stepped up when no one else in the black community would? Do you know who spent tireless hours putting flyers on the cars of persons parked in the churches of the black community? Do you know who waited for the church-goers to get out of church so that he could hand them flyers in an attempt to organize the black community against this horrible miscarriage of justice? Do you know who helped organize the City Hall meeting on January 8, 2011 at Sanford City Hall?? That person was GEORGE ZIMMERMAN.” – from a letter to Turner Clayton of the Seminole County NAACP written by “a concerned Zimmerman family member”

[zimmy]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

this little tidbit aint getting a lot of attention from the media...

The race part is irrelevant in my opinion and both sides are ignoring what is the bigger point. Unarmed kid followed by unprovoked armed adult and shot. No evidence of threat to life of shooter, beyond a few scrapes. Shooter never warned dead kid "get off or I will kill you." Screams on 911 call at time of shot shown not to be shooter. Give me a break. This shouldn't be about race or politics. It should be about the circumstances and whether it should go into the judiciary.

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by zimmy

. No evidence of threat to life of shooter, beyond a few scrapes. you know this how? CNN? Shooter never warned dead kid "get off or I will kill you." You must have been there, wow, have you called the investigators and let them know?
Screams on 911 call at time of shot shown not to be shooter. Uh, by 2 experts hired by the media, another one said it was inconclusive, this was not part of the investigation, it was from the media
. This shouldn't be about race or politics. It should be about the circumstances and whether it should go into the judiciary. agreed

you keep posting one sided, un proven, evidence

[zimmy]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

you keep posting one sided, un proven, evidence

The 911 phone call lasted for a substantial amount of time.. Did you listen to it? Also, I have seen the high detail video. It seems, to use one of your buddies on here favorite terms , common sense, that imminent threat of death or severe bodily harm would have caused a bit more damage. You right it is unproven but he did shoot and kill someone, who was unarmed. If Martin had busted into Zimmerman's house or gone after Zimmerman with a weapon without the provocation of chasing after him in the dark, it isn't even a story. It is the details that make it a story. I post what is reported about the night, you post a mostly irrelevant letter from a family member; irrelevant from a legal standpoint since the question isn't whether he killed him because of his race, but if he killed him because his own life was imminently threatened.

[Sea Dangles]

The great part about gun laws in Florida is that you DO NOT have to say "get off or I will kill you". You simply squeeze the trigger and deal with the consequences.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by zimmy

The 911 phone call lasted for a substantial amount of time.. Did you listen to it? Also, I have seen the high detail video. It seems, to use one of your buddies on here favorite terms , common sense, that imminent threat of death or severe bodily harm would have caused a bit more damage. You right it is unproven but he did shoot and kill someone, who was unarmed. If Martin had busted into Zimmerman's house or gone after Zimmerman with a weapon without the provocation of chasing after him in the dark, it isn't even a story. It is the details that make it a story. I post what is reported about the night, you post a mostly irrelevant letter from a family member; irrelevant from a legal standpoint since the question isn't whether he killed him because of his race, but if he killed him because his own life was imminently threatened.

"that imminent threat of death or severe bodily harm would have caused a bit more damage"

Are you a forensic doctor now? I've seen dead bodies of dead soldiers, and the only visible wound is a tiny dot somewhere where the bullet went in. The reasonableness of imminent threat of death is not based on the intensity of visible wounds. You don't necessarily need to leave a mark on someone in order for them to reasonably assume serious injury is imminent.

This is going to be a tough case investigate. Too many unknowns, and only one person is available to tell his side.

If it's true that Zimmerman was a crusader to hold cops accountable for racially-motivated beatings, it's interesting that his heroics there don't get as much media play as the doctored 911 call teryiong to paint him as a racist...

[fishbones]

Originally Posted by zimmy

The 911 phone call lasted for a substantial amount of time.. Did you listen to it? Also, I have seen the high detail video. It seems, to use one of your buddies on here favorite terms , common sense, that imminent threat of death or severe bodily harm would have caused a bit more damage. You right it is unproven but he did shoot and kill someone, who was unarmed. If Martin had busted into Zimmerman's house or gone after Zimmerman with a weapon without the provocation of chasing after him in the dark, it isn't even a story. It is the details that make it a story. I post what is reported about the night, you post a mostly irrelevant letter from a family member; irrelevant from a legal standpoint since the question isn't whether he killed him because of his race, but if he killed him because his own life was imminently threatened.

If someone was on top of you and slamming your head into the ground in the dark, and you couldn't see if they had a weapon, would you maybe think your life was being threatened? I guess Trayvon must have been telling Zimmerman not to worry because he was just giving him a beating and not really trying to hurt him. Unless you've been in the same situation, don't try to assume what either person was thinking at the time of the incident. You'd probably poop your pants if a punk kid in a hoodie came at you.

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by zimmy

The 911 phone call lasted for a substantial amount of time.. Did you listen to it? Also, I have seen the high detail video. It seems, to use one of your buddies on here favorite terms , common sense, that imminent threat of death or severe bodily harm would have caused a bit more damage. You right it is unproven but he did shoot and kill someone, who was unarmed. If Martin had busted into Zimmerman's house or gone after Zimmerman with a weapon without the provocation of chasing after him in the dark, it isn't even a story. It is the details that make it a story. I post what is reported about the night, you post a mostly irrelevant letter from a family member; irrelevant from a legal standpoint since the question isn't whether he killed him because of his race, but if he killed him because his own life was imminently threatened.

My only point in posting the letter was to show a side (potentially, I have no idea if its true) the media is not showing of Z. I have stated all along that we need to know the evidence before passing judgement. I have no clue what happened. If it was purely up to me, Z would be behind bars. But thats my heart, not my head. We dont know the details but I have to believe that there should be forensic evidence eaither way
There is a contant theme among liberals to immediatly doubt the police. I immediately believe the police. I was disqualified from a jury 2 yrs ago for a murder trial. I was asked if I would tend to believe the testimony of a police officer over a normal citizen and I said yes. I think on average, most cops are good people trying to do good things. I think most citizens suck

[zimmy]

Originally Posted by fishbones

I guess Trayvon must have been telling Zimmerman not to worry because he was just giving him a beating and not really trying to hurt him.

Missing the point completely. But, if I am going after a "punk kid in a hoodie" (not sure where you come off calling him that) with my 9mm on me, I better not be the kind of person who poops themselves if the kid comes back at me. That points to one of the cardinal rules of gun ownership.

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

My only point in posting the letter was to show a side (potentially, I have no idea if its true) the media is not showing of Z. I was asked if I would tend to believe the testimony of a police officer over a normal citizen and I said yes. I think on average, most cops are good people trying to do good things. I think most citizens suck

I think cops are citizens and like all realms of society, there are mostly good cops and a few bad. However, in this circumstance, I am suspicious that there may have been a tendency by some in the chain of command to hide behind the stand your ground law. Most citizens suck...interesting. That would make an interesting study, the correlation between opinions about citizens and political affiliations/tendencies.

[fishbones]

Originally Posted by zimmy

Missing the point completely. But, if I am going after a "punk kid in a hoodie" (not sure where you come off calling him that) with my 9mm on me, I better not be the kind of person who poops themselves if the kid comes back at me. That points to one of the cardinal rules of gun ownership.

There you go assuming again. There is nothing to show that Zimmerman went after Martin initially, just speculation (which you seem to take as fact). And based on the trouble the kid had been in in and out of school, he is a punk in my opinion. Just because he's a victim of a shooting doesn't make him a good kid.

[Piscator]

[QUOTE=zimmy;931519]But, if I am going after a "punk kid in a hoodie" (not sure where you come off calling him that) QUOTE]

Most kids that get suspended from school for 10 days are "punk kids"

Doesn't mean he should have been killed but lets face it, he was no model kid

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by zimmy

That would make an interesting study, the correlation between opinions about citizens and political affiliations/tendencies.

it would only make an interesting study if you stereotype.
Im a conservative who is not religious, believes in gay marriage, pro-life and that 99% of drugs should be legalized. Put me in the margin of error of your study. As someone who tries to be a thoughtful member of society, most people I run into suck.