long term striper management

[JohnnyD]

Without the paperwork that comes from selling fish, I fail to see how an angler registry can effectively be implemented. As long as I'm in possession of a legal fish from the shore to my home in case I get checked, who's going to look over my shoulder when I get home to make sure I register it?

[numbskull]

They don't plan nor need for you to register each fish. What they need is an accurate data base of who is a saltwater fisherman. With that information they can then efficiently do phone surveys of a random subset that will allow them to predict with a high degree of accuracy what is being caught, what is being kept, and how much effort it requires to catch it.

[Islander77]

Originally Posted by numbskull

What they need is an accurate data base of who is a saltwater fisherman. With that information they can then efficiently do phone surveys of a random subset that will allow them to predict with a high degree of accuracy what is being caught, what is being kept, and how much effort it requires to catch it.

True but to much like an honor system to me... I am a commercial guy at heart meaning I have, my father still does, and every man in my family BOTH SIDES moms and dads have fished for a living... That being said the thing is commercial boats have state and federal observers on board to keep them honest at times.. also A "few" grand in TRACKING equipment NO BS there the boats all are being tracked and have to call in departure/ arrival of port so everyone that thinks commercial is so easy try again sorry, if this upsets people sorry but its reality... Other than that I think the States of NE should really just effin step up with the squirrel cops thing.. I followed one down atlantic ave in westerly other night he checked the state beach lot and took off... I think the more the mortality comes from inexperienced people not knowing how to fish in addition to the arsses keeping short fish for NO reason.... My two cents

[bloocrab]

You have to be joking....I just shared a large bottle of wine with my father over an all you can eat clam boil so pardon my slurrring....

...but are you people that ignorant to believe that there could ever be a system that would even come close to keeping track of the number of fish...legal or not, that are caught by both commercial and recreational fishermen???? The number of fish that actually die after a non-successful release??? Or get discarded as bycatch ...or whatever/etc///.......most of the analytical numbers are bogus in my opinion. Like Saltheart said in the other thread, (but in my own words) ...most people on these websites are fairly honest ...but what about the other people. Mr. Saturday night, fishing off of a bridge...catching shorts and releasing them from a 40' drop? Or the guy who spends 20 minutes trying to unhook some trebles? Or the boats in an open oceanic spot where they know how much time they have before they can be possibly boarded???....

Soft science is an EXTREME understatement if you ask me.

I HAVE TO believe that the people that do catch regularly, KNOW what they're doing (more or less) ...and DO catch more than Mr. Saturday night who like Saltheart said, do NOT catch many fish.

Mr. Saturday night catches a shorty during his night and keeps it. Mr. Experienced internet hero catches 14 shorties and releases them all. Of the 14, 4 do not make it. Mr. Saturday night is responsible for 1 death (which he consumes), Mr. Internet HERO is responsible for 4 deaths? Who is doing more harm? The guy breaking the law...or the guy obeying the law but killing more fish?.....there's a Poll for ya.

[Islander77]

Originally Posted by bloocrab

You have to be joking....I just shared a large bottle of wine with my father over an all you can eat clam boil so pardon my slurrring....

...but are you people that ignorant to believe that there could ever be a system that would even come close to keeping track of the number of fish...legal or not, that are caught by both commercial and recreational fishermen???? The number of fish that actually die after a non-successful release??? Or get discarded as bycatch ...or whatever/etc///.......most of the analytical numbers are bogus in my opinion. Like Saltheart said in the other thread, (but in my own words) ...most people on these websites are fairly honest ...but what about the other people. Mr. Saturday night, fishing off of a bridge...catching shorts and releasing them from a 40' drop? Or the guy who spends 20 minutes trying to unhook some trebles? Or the boats in an open oceanic spot where they know how much time they have before they can be possibly boarded???....

Soft science is an EXTREME understatement if you ask me.

I HAVE TO believe that the people that do catch regularly, KNOW what they're doing (more or less) ...and DO catch more than Mr. Saturday night who like Saltheart said, do NOT catch many fish.

Mr. Saturday night catches a shorty during his night and keeps it. Mr. Experienced internet hero catches 14 shorties and releases them all. Of the 14, 4 do not make it. Mr. Saturday night is responsible for 1 death (which he consumes), Mr. Internet HERO is responsible for 4 deaths? Who is doing more harm? The guy breaking the law...or the guy obeying the law but killing more fish?.....there's a Poll for ya.

That wine really went to your head.. As far as by-catch goes hmm most draggers are after suqid now bluefish is a bycatch plenty of that on pallets lately... AND FOR THE RECORD YES COMMERCIAL GUYS DONT HAVE A CAKE WALK OH I CAN KILL WHATEVER LIFE YALL THINK I DONT CARE HOW MUCH WINE YOU HAVE THAT WILL NOT CHANGE THEY ARE REGULATED MONITORED AND TRACKED ALL THE WHILE THE HAVE AN OBSERVER ON BOARD... NOT ROD AND REEL COMMERCIAL IM TALKING ACTUAL COMMERCIAL.. Rod and reel is totally different and wont be round much longer the way the industry is headed.....And soon enough we will all be sittin here saying man fishin was so much better before GATES FISHING INC. took over the government want big business not small independent guys reality if that happens kiss our ocean good bye!!!!!!!!!!!

[numbskull]

Originally Posted by bloocrab

...but are you people that ignorant to believe that there could ever be a system that would even come close to keeping track of the number of fish...legal or not, that are caught by both commercial and recreational fishermen???? The number of fish that actually die after a non-successful release??? Or get discarded as bycatch ...or whatever/etc///.......most of the analytical numbers are bogus in my opinion. :

Yikes, this is heading downhill fast. Every striped bass fisherman, commercial and recreational (including catch and release guys), kills fish.
Habitat degradation, forage depletion (of which other commercial fisheries are a major factor), disease, and natural predation kill fish.

Nobody expects to be able to "keep track" of each fish caught. They only want to improve the accuracy of their estimates, which are then used in an overall model to predict current and future fish populations. Those predictions are then tested against real world catch numbers, sampling results, and anecdotal experience. Like it or not, managing a resource requires this. That the numbers are "bogus" and too easily manipulated for alternate agendas is a fact of life. Better data can help improve that. The alternative is no fishery whatsoever.

[bloocrab]

Originally Posted by Islander77

That wine really went to your head.....

....head, shoulders, knees and toes,,, (had to throw that in there as that's all I hear in my sleep now..with the new baby)

...NOT ROD AND REEL COMMERCIAL IM TALKING ACTUAL COMMERCIAL.. Rod and reel is totally different...

DON'T TAKE OFFENSE TO MY POST!!!!....again, IMO...the majority of the members on this site are Rec...and Commie R&R,,,, but I could be wrong as I don't dig into everyone's business. It will ALWAYS be a GUEsstimate in my opinion....and just like horse/shoes...at times they may come close.

1. They only want to improve the accuracy of their estimates, ///// 2..Those predictions are then tested against real world catch numbers,......//// 3. Like it or not, managing a resource requires this.....//// 4. That the numbers are "bogus" and too easily manipulated for alternate agendas is a fact of life. .....///
Yesterday 10:18 PM

1. Point taken, but How accurate do YOU really think they can get? and WHY do you feel that way?

2. Real World Catch Numbers = ???,???,??? What is this?

3. Resources need to be managed and YES, these types of resources are VERY difficult to manage. I just don't like reading reports that give you an actual number. I read something in the Fisherman the other day that placed a number on how many people fished last year and how many fish were caught. Again, where the helll are they getting this data from?

4. Your final statement sums up my point.


...oh yeah, and lastly Mr. Numbskull....my intentions were not to drive this truck downhill....my apologies as I know my post came off a bit ,,, I've said it once and I'll say it again, I don't really know what I'm talking about, sometimes I just like to talk.

[MAKAI]

You ever see a british sportfishing mag ?
The conger eel and trash fish are the trophies.
We are inexorably heading down this same path.
So many different opinions on what needs to be done that ultimately nothing gets done.
It's what people do best, as my buddy Paul says," It's like herding cats."
So catch them while you can.

[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by Islander77

NOT ROD AND REEL COMMERCIAL IM TALKING ACTUAL COMMERCIAL.. Rod and reel is totally different and wont be round much longer the way the industry is headed.....

Which is a major part of the problem.

The less selective the fisheries have gotten over the years, the smaller tha average catch, and the worse it has gotten. More selective fisheries should be WHERE we are headed.