Why isn't the simulas having an effect?

[Slipknot]

Originally Posted by buckman

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I wish it would. Any ideas? Alot of very educated guys on here. Help me out. IMO it's because it's a scam. You?

I don't know, it depends on what you mean by educated.

I have enough common sense I think to take a guess and say that I doubt this stimulus package if it has gotten into gear yet will have done anything immediate to the stock market.
What are you looking for miracles?
Maybe have some patience and give the guy a chance.

I personally don't agree with all this bailout crap, I say let them stand on their own 2 feet like I've had to do all my life, if they need to file for reorganization bankruptcy, then so be it. Putting the country way into further debt seems like a huge mistake to me.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by Slipknot

I personally don't agree with all this bailout crap, I say let them stand on their own 2 feet like I've had to do all my life, if they need to file for reorganization bankruptcy, then so be it. Putting the country way into further debt seems like a huge mistake to me.

Agreed. Especially since AIG couldn't recover after the first few billion dollars they got and now they're being given more. The government has to pick their battles. Not everyone struggling should get a handout, only those with potential to recover.

My opinion is even more critical for the automotive industry. They are struggling because they have a business plan that has positioned themselves in a way that showed no outlook over the long term. Automotive companies have taken no initiative to create more fuel efficient vehicles and only do just enough to pass government-mandated standards. They have an archaic business plan and as such, positioned themselves for failure. They've also allowed the unions to rake them through the coals. It's no surprise to me that the one automotive manufacturer doing better than the rest has taken into consideration future markets and is also non-union.

[striperman36]

The autos may have no plan but why can't I buy this 53 mpg Volvo in America? They won't even sell it here, because we don't like diesels? Crazy
http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2008/09/1...%99t-have-one/

[striperman36]

http://blog.wired.com/cars/2009/02/volvos-low-carb.html

• C30: 60.3 mph and 104 g/km.
• S40 and V50: 58.8 mpg and 107 g/km.
• V70 and S80: 48.8 mpg and 129 g/km
• XC60 and XC70: 39.2 mpg and 159 g/km.

I looked all over for a small diesel, did get a 2.8L Jeep, about .5L more than I really wanted.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by striperman36

The autos may have no plan but why can't I buy this 53 mpg Volvo in America? They won't even sell it here, because we don't like diesels? Crazy
http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2008/09/1...%99t-have-one/

It's because of a stigma put in place 20-30 years about about dirty diesel being horribly polluting - remember when the soot exhausted from Mach trucks was a big hot topic? Also, people don't realize even though they pay about 20% more for diesel, they get about that and more in fuel economy when compared to an equivalent unleaded.

[buckman]

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

It's because of a stigma put in place 20-30 years about about dirty diesel being horribly polluting - remember when the soot exhausted from Mach trucks was a big hot topic? Also, people don't realize even though they pay about 20% more for diesel, they get about that and more in fuel economy when compared to an equivalent unleaded.

Not to mention that a diesel can last several hundred thousand miles more. Thus justifing the added initial cost. I have yet to hear a reasonable explanation as to why diesel fuel is more then gas. Prior to 2003 it was cheaper.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by buckman

Not to mention that a diesel can last several hundred thousand miles more. Thus justifing the added initial cost. I have yet to hear a reasonable explanation as to why diesel fuel is more then gas. Prior to 2003 it was cheaper.

I've read a few articles that include Fishparts reasoning but also with others. Now, I don't know nearly enough on how the supply of fuel works but this is what I've read.

Until several years ago, the average price of diesel fuel was usually lower than the average price of gasoline. In some winters when the demand for distillate heating oil was high, the price of diesel fuel rose above the gasoline price. Since September 2004, the price of diesel fuel has been generally higher than the price of regular gasoline all year round for several reasons. Worldwide demand for diesel fuel and other distillate fuel oils has been increasing steadily, with strong demand in China, Europe, and the U.S., putting more pressure on the tight global refining capacity. In the U.S., the transition to low-sulfur diesel fuel has affected diesel fuel production and distribution costs. Also, the Federal excise tax on diesel fuel is 6 cents higher per gallon (24.4 cents per gallon) than the tax on gasoline.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/6846...an-regular-gas


And my personal favorite:

In the end, the best explanation may be, as William of Ockham believed, the simplest one. Perhaps diesel prices have gone high and stayed there because that's what the market will bear. In that older article, we asked a petroleum industry insider why oil companies were charging so much for diesel. The insider's telling reply:

"Because we can."

http://blogs.edmunds.com/strategies/...-than-gas.html

[justplugit]

Originally Posted by Slipknot

I don't know, it depends on what you mean by educated.

Putting the country way into further debt seems like a huge mistake to me.

It just doesn't make sense. Let's get the economy back on it's feet first before we start passing bills that will put us into further debt and cause inflation down the road.
To follow the same path of spending what we didn't have in the first place, for whatever reasons, got us into this mess, how is it going to get us out?

We need stimulus based on concrete needs that can be started now.
Like infrastucter repair based on what really needs fixing, and there's alot of that.
Mass transit building with high speed mono rails.

People are afraid and we need something people can see to rally around to get back confidence now, not just things that are just ideas and are 10-15 years down the road before they come to fruition.

Ya, Green is good but till we get there we need oil and nuclear. These would create jobs within a few months. We will always need it as you can't run a military or even charge electric cars, all on wind or batteries.

Most of all we need something to rally the whole country around, FDR had WW2, not that that was good, Kennedy had space exploration, Regan brought back a feeling of patriotism.

Not that we shouldn't have different opinions, but "united we stand, divided we fall."