I told you they were a bunch of criminals

[sok]

[QUOTE=Pete_G]I haven't been following this news story too closely, but "peppered with buckshot" as was reported by the ranch owner is whole lot different then having a piece of buckshot either in the proximity of your heart or migrating towards it and causing a heart attack.

Maybe it was just shock?
A firearm being fired close to you but not by you (outside of a range when you expect it) really gets the adrenaline going.
(I know)
The guy was 78.
Bird shot out of a 28 gauge at 30 yds. 90 feet.
That's about the end of the effective range of a shotgun; isn't it?

[Nebe]

#^&#^&#^&#^& had a roast beef sandwich before the trip

can you believe that??

[zacs]

so if this dude croaks from complications can they charge #^&#^&#^&#^& with involuntary manslaughter?

[MoroneSaxatilis]

Originally Posted by Nebe

#^&#^&#^&#^& had a roast beef sandwich before the trip
can you believe that??

There is much controversy surrounding this issue. It's still unclear whether the sandwich was made with fresh or previously frozen roast beef, and whether it had mustard or mayo on it.
There are even reports surfacing now that it may not even have BEEN roast beef, but some sort of luncheon meat.

[Pete_G]

Originally Posted by sok

Maybe it was just shock?
A firearm being fired close to you but not by you (outside of a range when you expect it) really gets the adrenaline going.
(I know)
The guy was 78.
Bird shot out of a 28 gauge at 30 yds. 90 feet.
That's about the end of the effective range of a shotgun; isn't it?

I don't really know anything about guns other then paintball guns. If there's penetration near or into his heart though I'd have to say that he was in the "effective range" of the weapon.

My only point was the intial description of "peppering", in my view, implies lack of penetration versus what we have here, a BB possibly lodged in his heart and others elsewhere.

No one seems to have really discussed how badly he was hit. They mention face, throat and chest, but not much else. Now we learn there was clearly penetration and I just find it odd we didn't really know that before. And since you say that he was standing at the extreme end of "effective range" yet we have serious penetration, I can't help but be a bit suspicious of the reported distance. It's just my nature...

Again, I haven't been following this too closely, I may have missed a more accurate description of what took place that was released a couple days earlier.

[Raven]

will never be truly accurate....

what was said was... just after he fired....

ok -> this is what we're going to say happened...

and as far as penetration your exactly right because the pellet lodged in his heart had to go thru hunting clothing first...

what scares me is ...in the event we lost our current president...
this BOZO would be the commander in chief...

[Pete_G]

Originally Posted by Raven

ok -> this is what we're going to say happened...

and as far as penetration your exactly right because the pellet lodged in his heart had to go thru hunting clothing first...

Good point. For a BB to go that deep with heavy clothing on it definitely requires some serious velocity.

[PaulS]

its the 2nd most important person in the US, shouldn't the American public be told? We had to hear about it 2nd hand. McClellan feels its ok for a private citizen to speak for the VP!!!

Its indicative of this administrations secretiveness and heavy handiness.

Doesn't anyone own a cellphone and couldn't they contact the police right away rather than wait 1 1/2 hours. If they know he was serious enough to be helicoptored to the hospital they should have called the authorities right away.

If they had a press conference and and told us there would be no story other than a few late night jokes.

Drs say he was hit with between 6 and 200 pellets.

[mekcotuit]

Full of Holes
The gossip about Cheney's bad shot.
By Paul Burka
Posted Tuesday, Feb. 14, 2006, at 6:52 PM ET

Austin, TEXAS—The headquarters of Harry Whittington, the 78-year-old Austin lawyer who was shot by Vice President #^&#^&#^&#^& Cheney in a hunting accident Saturday, is the nondescript 10-story Vaughn Building, located a block from the Texas Capitol in downtown Austin. Because of Whittington's lifelong Republican credentials, the building has always been a favorite of GOP politicos. Today, however, it has become ground zero for anyone trying to get the latest news about Harry's condition, as well as about what really happened on the Armstrong Ranch last Saturday morning.
Harry's office—he is always referred to by his first name here—is on the 10th floor, and many tenants have dropped in or called to inquire about how he's doing. None of the ones I spoke to want to be quoted by name, because many of them are questioning the official accounts of the accident. The place is aswirl in rumor and speculation, especially since Harry suffered what was described as a mild heart attack Tuesday morning. Keep in mind that hunting, especially quail hunting, is deeply embedded in the political culture of this state, and invitations to hunt on prestigious spreads like the Armstrong Ranch are among the most prized of political perks.

The talk in the Vaughn Building centers around three questions:

Who was in charge of the hunt? As many Americans are learning for the first time, quail hunting is dangerous—arguably the most dangerous type of hunting. Participants, usually a threesome, follow dogs through thick brush and tall grass seeking what Karl Rove, a dedicated quail hunter, calls "the wily bob white." When the quail flush, hunters are surrounded by panicked birds. Each hunter is supposed to fire forward, but in the adrenalin spike of the flush, it is easy to lose your bearings. That is why it's good practice for someone who is not shooting to be in charge of the hunt. The hunters are supposed to maintain a horizontal line as they move forward, but this is easier than it sounds in rough country. When someone falls behind—someone, for instance, like Harry Whittington—the person in charge calls a halt until the line forms up again. Whittington, as we know, dropped back to pick up a bird. This happens all the time in quail hunting; the question is, why did the other two hunters keep going? Perhaps, veteran quail hunters are speculating, no one was in charge on the Armstrong Ranch, leaving the three hunters in #^&#^&#^&#^& Cheney's party on their own while hostess Katharine Armstrong watched from the car that had transported them.

At what range was Harry Whittington hit? The official story is that the blast from the vice president's shotgun hit Whittington at a distance of 30 yards. Hunters at the Vaughn Building are skeptical. The hunt took place on a cold, windy afternoon. Whittington and his fellow hunters were probably wearing warm clothing—say, a jacket and a flannel shirt. Cheney was using a 28-gauge shotgun, a smaller-diameter firearm with pellets smaller than BBs. Whittington's friends question whether the pellets could have penetrated his layers of clothing and skin at that range. Yet two pellets lodged against his larynx, another was in his liver, and another migrated into the heart muscle, causing the heart attack. The pattern of wounds was between the lower chest and the forehead, a pretty tight zone for shot of 30 yards. If the range was considerably less than 30 yards, then it is likely that Whittington's injuries were worse than the initial statement by Katharine Armstrong indicated. (The blast "knocked him silly," but "he was fine.")

Whose fault was it? If there is anything that Harry's friends at the Vaughn Building are angry about, it is not the shooting itself but the attempt by White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan to place the blame on the victim. It's the shooter's duty to know what he is shooting at and where his companions are. A shooting accident is always the fault of the shooter. Always.

[RIROCKHOUND]

The scary thing is..
If the guy had died we NEVER would have heard about it... he would have 'had a heart attack' during the hunt....
Remember... the Truth is out there

[Raven]

Originally Posted by PaulS

Drs say he was hit with between 6 and 200 pellets.

a 28 gauge shot gun fired at a range of thirty yards???
thats ninty 90 feet....and he's hit chest high with 200 pellets
like this...???

[Raven]

he'd have to be firing level or below level where your not supposed to be shooting when your in a group hunt... it makes no sense..this story...was he shooting them at what ...5 feet off the ground....
sounds like total bull s h i t lies
but thats just my opinion
my sixth sense....
is telling me ....cover-up....
and i have a very strong
sixth sense.