Outrageous

[Slipknot]

the head of homeland security should resign

this report of hers is a bunch of bs

http://townhall.com/columnists/Miche...2%80%A6?page=2

I didn't know the American Legion is a "hate group"


I agree with this guys' comment =

KATZ Location: TX
Reply # 2
Date: Apr 15, 2009 - 12:24 AM EST
Resign
Napolitano is unfit for her position and needs to resign immediately. An apology is owed the millions of honest Americans and the hundreds of thousands of veterans that have been insulted by this vile document. Anytime the government attempts to bully and intimidate the citizenry, things have already gotten out of hand. It is time for Obama to stop this before any more damage is done.
---------------------------


maybe this should be in the political forum, but I can't stand going in that forum

[spence]

Read the actual report instead of a radical right-wing opinion.

http://www.fas.org/irp/eprint/rightwing.pdf

The DHS didn't label the American Legion a hate group, that's an assertion by Malkin. The article you linked to is using quotes to mislead.

The DHS report did get a lot of flack from the American Legion who thought it was unfairly accusing returning veterans of being a risk. If you read the actual report the position isn't necessarily that veterans themselves are more likely to be radicals, but that the rightwing hate groups are more likely to see returning vets who may be having difficulty integrating back into society as recruitment targets.

While I think the DHS should have been more careful in its wording, there certianly is some truth to this statement and you do have Timmothy McVeigh as exibit A.

The DHS did issue an appology on the issue which I think is appropriate, but to say she should resign is pretty absurd.

-spence

[Raven]

Have not been enforced adequately since their origination

so if anyone argues for enforcement they cannot be called
a hate group for doing so........ no matter who they are.

[JohnnyD]

I went to your link Slip.

It's impossibly for me to take any publication seriously that's offering:

"Ann Coulter's 'Guilty' Free when you subscribe to Townhall magazine"

More BS comes out of that woman's mouth in one day than an entire cattle farm pumps out in a year.

[RIJIMMY]

just curious.
Why are groups like the Nazis labeled 'right wing" when they are a socialist organization and have more in common with the left wing?
I think this is spawned from a belief, which the media feeds, the right is intolerant and anti-civil rights which is wrong. For example anyone watch John Stewart yesterday and his piece on the tea partys? The left has been apparantly fighting racism and civil rights for years..........huh?

[RIJIMMY]

so I just read the entire doc spence linked to.
Interesting we just left a period where there were more anti-Bush protests (btw, he was the president) yet there was no risk of radicals? Are liberal radicals ok, or just not smart enough to be organized to worry about?d Bush was accused of using "fear" to sway the populace, seems the same tactic to me. Anyone anti-Obama is a racist right winger hell bent on naziism

[spence]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

just curious.
Why are groups like the Nazis labeled 'right wing" when they are a socialist organization and have more in common with the left wing?
I think this is spawned from a belief, which the media feeds, the right is intolerant and anti-civil rights which is wrong. For example anyone watch John Stewart yesterday and his piece on the tea partys? The left has been apparantly fighting racism and civil rights for years..........huh?

Generally speaking, hate groups are more likely to be exclusive.

-spence

[RIJIMMY]

which is another thing in common with the left. Obama should know, he was the member of one of those churches for 20 yrs
The whole thing reads like a thesis built upon Obamas comments "These people cling to their guns and religion"
This is scary stuff, I try not to be a wacky conspiracy theorist, but this is really becoming a total left wing attack on the american culture and free speech. That doc is intended to feed paranoia.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

Are liberal radicals ok, or just not smart enough to be organized to worry about?

The difference is that liberal radicals aren't gun-crazy, revolutionists like you Conservatives.

[spence]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

which is another thing in common with the left. Obama should know, he was the member of one of those churches for 20 yrs
The whole thing reads like a thesis built upon Obamas comments "These people cling to their guns and religion"
This is scary stuff, I try not to be a wacky conspiracy theorist, but this is really becoming a total left wing attack on the american culture and free speech. That doc is intended to feed paranoia.

The document is intended to highlight evidence that indicates a potential threat to the American people the Government might need to be prepared to address. I'd wager the Government writes reports like this all the time that single out various groups, but as this one mentions veterans the "liberals hate the military" card is being played to perhaps make it into something it isn't.

At the end of the day we do have a black President that has raised the ire of a lot of racist groups, gun sales are through the roof, anti-government emotions are running high and there are/will be tens of thousands of servicepeople returning home, some of whom could be targets for recruitment by hate groups.

I'd wager that if it called out American Muslim service people the Liberals would be in a tizzy and the Right would be singing high praises

-spence

[fishbones]

Spence, I thought our President was bi-racial. Since he was born to a white mother and a black father, wouldn't he be just as much white as black? Or you could just refer to him as an American, as I do. I guess some superficial people see the need to point out a persons race.

[spence]

Originally Posted by fishbones

Spence, I thought our President was bi-racial. Since he was born to a white mother and a black father, wouldn't he be just as much white as black? Or you could just refer to him as an American, as I do. I guess some superficial people see the need to point out a persons race.

By superficial I'm assuming you're talking about racist hate groups?

-spence

[spence]

Interesting...

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123992665198727459.html

The documents outlining Operation Vigilant Eagle cite a surge in activity by such groups. The memos say the FBI's focus on veterans began as far back as December, during the final weeks of the Bush administration, when the bureau's domestic counterterrorism division formed a special joint working group with the Defense Department.

Who would have thought that Bush hated veterans as well?

-spence

[fishbones]

Originally Posted by spence

By superficial I'm assuming you're talking about racist hate groups?

-spence

If you read your post, you refer to Obama as "black". That's pointing out his race. As for racial hate groups, I know you'd never join one. Their uniforms are definitely not stylish enough for you.

[spence]

Originally Posted by fishbones

If you read your post, you refer to Obama as "black". That's pointing out his race.

Black is also a color (or technically the absence of color) as well as a racial description. I'd wager that most racial hate groups don't think of Obama as any less black because he's bi-racial. Actually they probably think it's a bigger obamanation

I guess we could ignore the fact that he has black skin, and that it's significant, and that people hate him for it. But I'm sure you're just being silly anyway.

As for racial hate groups, I know you'd never join one. Their uniforms are definitely not stylish enough for you.

I was fortunate to grow up in a household with no bigotry, or about as close as you can get. As for hate groups, they tend to dress alike which doesn't fit with my flair for individuality.

-spence

[Nebe]

white is the absense of color.. Black is total color saturation.

Originally Posted by spence

Black is also a color (or technically the absence of color) as well as a racial description. I'd wager that most racial hate groups don't think of Obama as any less black because he's bi-racial. Actually they probably think it's a bigger obamanation

I guess we could ignore the fact that he has black skin, and that it's significant, and that people hate him for it. But I'm sure you're just being silly anyway.


I was fortunate to grow up in a household with no bigotry, or about as close as you can get. As for hate groups, they tend to dress alike which doesn't fit with my flair for individuality.

-spence

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[spence]

Originally Posted by Nebe

white is the absense of color.. Black is total color saturation.

Nope, think about the color temperatures and not the reflected properties.

-spence

[fishbones]

Originally Posted by spence

Black is also a color (or technically the absence of color) as well as a racial description. I'd wager that most racial hate groups don't think of Obama as any less black because he's bi-racial. Actually they probably think it's a bigger obamanation

I guess we could ignore the fact that he has black skin, and that it's significant, and that people hate him for it. But I'm sure you're just being silly anyway.


I was fortunate to grow up in a household with no bigotry, or about as close as you can get. As for hate groups, they tend to dress alike which doesn't fit with my flair for individuality.

-spence

You're right, I was just having a little fun with you. I would never put you in the same class as those idiots.
As for this whole flap with the veterans, I'm sure it was just a poor choice of words which she now deeply regrets. If every politician had to resign when they made a stupid and/or insensitive comment about a group of people, we'd have very few left to run the country. Wait, maybe I'm onto something...

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by spence

Nope, think about the color temperatures and not the reflected properties.

-spence

I'm going with Nebe. I'd much rather believe the gay Artist than the Fashionista.

I think what I saw on the Today show (think it was Today) with Napolitano was dumb. Unimpressed.

[spence]

Originally Posted by JohnR

I'm going with Nebe. I'd much rather believe the gay Artist than the Fashionista.

Actually I have a BFA as well

-spence

[justplugit]

Originally Posted by Slipknot

I didn't know the American Legion is a "hate group"

Don't worry Slip, they are not a "hate group",
they are just possible "man - caused disasters."

[JohnR]

Originally Posted by spence

Actually I have a BFA as well

-spence

Why am I not surprised

Still stickin' with Eben. He blows art.

[spence]

Originally Posted by fishbones

As for this whole flap with the veterans, I'm sure it was just a poor choice of words which she now deeply regrets.

I read most of the actual document and don't have many issues with the words. Context is very important here...

If the context was a Government pragmatically looking at individual factors that when combined could form a threat then it seems pretty reasonable.

If the context was an Liberal civil rights group trying to paint our troops as out of control killers, which some certainly do, then the report could be seen as anti-military and objectionable.

Considering it looks like the FBI initiatives behind this report span both Administrations, one could really question the objectivity of the Malkin piece that started this thread.

It does appear there was a debate internally as to why the report should be made public. Considering that Napolitano isn't seen as a partisan, I doubt this was a hit job, just perhaps clumsy.

-spence

[Slipknot]

Context, spin, whatever.........

United we stand
Divide we fall

[spence]

Well, you said she should resign based on the Malkin article, which looks to be highly suspect.

That being said, it looks like Malkin is the divider.

-spence

[Slipknot]

so it's Malkin's fault

[spence]

Originally Posted by Slipknot

so it's Malkin's fault

Not sure if there's a person at fault. But as for Malkin, she's not reporting the facts. She's a spinner out to divide with the hope of scoring some airtime on cable TV.

-spence