Lawn Care Advice

[Slingah]

To all you greenthumbs out there...I am looking for some advice on getting my lawn heathy with minimal work. It is not all that bad just needs a bit of help.
Should I check pH, then lime?? What about fertilizer and seeding bare spots?? Should I reseed?? ( I am ignorant to lawncare)
I do not want to dig up the lawn and start over...I'm just looking to make it a bit thicker and greener...
Thanks in advance

[Saltheart]

this year i am going back to Turfbuilder products by Scotts. there are cheaper alternatives but for years , 4 applications at $30 to $45 each 9depending on if there are weed controls added , etc) and the lawn looks great. i will also be liming my lawn this year as its been a while and soil in this artea tends to go acid with time.

scratching bare spots and reseeding speeds things up but if the lawn is healthy and the weeds controlled , the good grass will eventually fill in the bare spots. i think the only areas that really need scratching and seeding are the areas with moss growing.

Goose has a green thumb , maybe he can chime in .

[fishsmith]

Scotts does make the lawn look great quick, but my experience was the grass degraded at an accelerated rate when I stopped using their product.

I wonder if Scotts works faster because their fertilizer is 'finer' than the pebble sized fertilizer you find in other products like Lecso.

I lost the nice lawn battle, but have learned to love the color brown and aquired a taste for dust when I mow.

[Saltheart]

I tried two different chemlawn type companies. They made a big improvement the first year , great lawn the second , on the wane the third and worse than when started the 4 th. I'm going back to Scotts. That worked great for about 30 years. I don't know why they work well. they just do.

[zimmy]

You can get a cheap test for your soil to see if you need lime or take a sample to a county extension office. Get an organic fertilizer which releases nutrients over time as opposed to most chem types. (also causes less salt build up in the soil than the chem types ) Spread it as directed (usually spring and fall.) Get a bag of milky spore and spread it two years in a row for grubs (could be why you have bare spots). You also might try nematodes this season as they will immediately kill this years grubs. You might get 2 or 3 years where you don't have to do anything for grubs after you get those things established. Keep the grass about 3" long to out compete the weeds. If the bare spots are pretty big, you might till them and add a layer of compost and re-seed. Do these things and you will have a nice healthy lawn that is safe for you, pets, kids and anything else that goes in it. One of the main problems in our waterways and estuaries is lawn chemicals, so if you can live with a nice yard that has some clover and stuff mixed with the grass it is worth it. Also, if you have enough compost, you can spread a thin layer over the grass and not need any other fertilizer. Less fertilizers = more fluke

[justplugit]

Matt, aside from agreeing with Karl, try the following. Rent an overseeder slicer. It will slice the soil and drop the seed so it comes in contact with the soil which is necessary for germination.

Only Scotts products i use are their seed as they have good mixes for sun or shade, have a high germination rate and very low weed content.

Find a %50 organic or %50 WIN fert a 2-1-1 ratio, it will tell you on the bag. example 16-8-8 or 20-10-10 or even 10-6-4 which is close. Agway has excellent ferts.

After you seed,apply #40 pelitized lime 2500 sg ft. and fertilize at full rate on bag.

If you don't like cutting use the same fert at 1/2 the rate Memorial Day - Fourth of July and Labor Day which will keep it green and thick. Next year around St Patricks day start your fertilizer program.

Fertilzing at any other time will just increase the growth of crabgrass and broadleaf weeds. Spot kill the weeds with a sprayer in mid June after your seed has had a chance to germinate and has been cut at least 3 times.

Get a broadcast fertilizer spreader it will make things real easy.


Don't overwater= fungus.

[Mr. Sandman]

Scotts 4 step is the way to go. Supplement for problems as needed (grubs, insects fungus etc)Use their speedy green spreader too.

Organics are expensive, don't work most of the time and you have to put a TON of it on your lawn.


PS the 4 step is on sale now too..

[Raven]

Originally Posted by justplugit

Matt, aside from agreeing with Karl, try the following. Rent an overseeder slicer. It will slice the soil and drop the seed so it comes in contact with the soil which is necessary for germination.

Only Scotts products i use are their seed as they have good mixes for sun or shade, have a high germination rate and very low weed content.



Get a broadcast fertilizer spreader it will make things real easy.


Don't overwater= fungus.

==========================================
In the old days ...everyone had a water filled or solid concrete
roller in their backyard or had a deal to work out a share program with a neighbor.... this was so they literally pressed the grass seed into the soil making sure it had firm contact with the soil which encourages germination... (extremely important)

now a days people spread it with a spreader and water it to death without hardly even scratching it in... or they cover it with hay...

and the hydroseed companies have a much higher germination rate because their grass seed is pre germinated in their tanks and its sprayed down with a green moisture holding substance too.

the coolest thing i ever saw while working on golf courses was the finger hole maker which had a bank of tubes jamming them into the turf then popping out the plugs which you had to rake up and deposit elsewhere. Then you had a grass surface with thousands of finger sized holes , so we'd spread compost on top and lightly rake that back into the holes to increase the organic matter instantly.

Exactly what worms do..........

the funny thing or SAD thing was.... they had special chemicals to kill all the earth worms because a big old worm casting ball on the surface would stop or deflect a golf ball and that was a NO NO.

[Raven]

i have never bought a Scott's lawn product ever! nor will i .

why ? because, yeah you can throw it in an easy spreader and roll that around your lawn.... but what your doing is encouraging shallow roots for your grass plants... and they're getting their intravenous fertilizer fix right on the surface plus that chemical fertilizer is screwing up the ecosystem big time with run off and killing off all the earthworms.

They are your natural composters that aerate (with their burrows) the lawn which allows for quick drainage when it pours cats and dogs getting that much needed rain water down to the deeper root zone and increasing organic matter in your lawn's soil.

~ (btw:wood ashes do the same thing as lime so use it instead of lime....) it's just not as strong....

what you want to do is to encourage root growth and your earthworm population simultaneously!

when your source of maple leaves
(never use oak as they have a root inhibitor (tanic acid) built right into them)
or any other non oak leaf pile that is fairly dry, you make long wind rows of them across your lawn and run them over with your lawn mower
shredding them into confetti or worm food.

[Rule of green thumb]:
feed your worms and let them feed your lawn]

the shredded leaves you spread around to bare spots (sprinkle with grass seed first) and this encourages worms to make a burrow nearby and then drag the leaf pieces each night directly into the ground increasing the organic matter into your lawn.

NOTE: organic matter or "humus" holds ten times it's weight in water...and Scott's fertilizer can't ever do that.

the other thing is to let your grass stay a little longer than usual by about an inch to help shade the ground thus conserving moisture and smothering out the weeds.

you can always cut it shorter when company is coming... but i never "ever" cut my grass "unless" it's just about to rain....and as your just finishing mowing..... it should be sprinkling rain already.

I almost sharpen my mower blade every other time i cut too , so each individual blade of grass is cut and not whacked which cuts down on grass mortality and dehydration.

lastly , if you print out my fishing calender and cut your lawn on the days marked just before it rains preferably before the full moon it will encourage growth big time...where as if your grass is growing like way to fast !!cut it on the days that are not marked to decrease growth ............so you'll have more time to fish.

btw: if you frequently see yellow shafted flickers on your lawn
probing it for bugs...you have grubs as its easier for them to get a meal there than banging on a tree... so , then you should first treat your lawn for grubs before starting your organic lawn care.

a truly healthy lawn should have night crawlers leaving earthworm casting piles of excreted organic matter on the lawn each evening.

they have the unique ability to alter the soils ph back to neutral 7.0
in this way. NATURE NEVER USES LIME

[Fishpart]

Originally Posted by Raven

ibtw: if you frequently see yellow shafted flickers on your lawn
probing it for bugs...you have grubs as its easier for them to get a meal there than banging on a tree... so , then you should first treat your lawn for grubs before starting your organic lawn care.

So what is the best way to eradicate the grubs??? I have a flicker colony going on..

[Slingah]

wow..alot of good stuff here..I am looking for the semi-easy way out....probaly go the Scotts route..
Squirrels have dug up the back yard pretty good the past couple of days??? are they eating grubs???

[Raven]

Originally Posted by Fishpart

So what is the best way to eradicate the grubs??? I have a flicker colony going on..

other than rototilling to expose them to the birds you'll have to either use chemicals that target the grubs specifically or look for an organic grub killer...if there is such a thing. moles and shrews eat worms and grubs... typically keeping them in balance....

those grubs eat grass roots so they'll kill the lawn every time...
the grubs are there because Nature is out of balance in that lawn.

[nautibuoys]

I had same experience as Saltheart and went back to Scott's a couple years ago. Never looked back. Was told you should check Ph, but if you don't or can't, spreading lime will likely help and definitley won't hurt (i.e., remember-acid rain).

[Goose]

Raven, Question #2: do you have a job? You don't have to answer that.

[Goose]

The simple way is usually the better way to live. You take all you can from your resources, after all thats what its there for. Work only makes you healthy and you save$ to boot.

Imo...everyone who has a yard should have a garden. Not only does it put fresh food on the table but the time spent working on it is carefree time that clear the head,, it like fishing in some ways. The more you partake in it the more you realize the earth doesn't need you....you need the earth. The more you realize this truth the more respect you have for life.

[Raven]

i am splurging today

bought $40.00 bucks of heating oil this morning...... wow!

and i get to turn the heat on.... 28 degrees this mornin, chilly

after pancakes i'll build a fire

i enjoy fishing the most when i know that i'm harvesting
sunshine back home....

i couldn't live without a garden
anymore than i could live without ever fishing

[ProfessorM]

I try to eliminate a few feet of lawn every year with more beds for shrubs and plants. I dig up grass and throw it in the compost pile, lay down wood chips and leaves and plant something. I am not a slave to a lawn and would rather have my acre planted with beds and only a small strip of grass to accent the beds. I don't want all the chemicals involved with having a nice lawn. Mine is mostly assorted grass and weeds but it is green and that is all I care about. No time for the lawn thing. Got to pick my battles.

I am with Goose. I enjoy diggin holes and picking weeds and planting things as much as fishing. Sick I know but I love it. Good clean exercise, and a feeling of accomplishment. Good hard physical labor never hurt anybody. In fact it would do most people in this country, especially young folks, a world of good. Get outdoors. P.

[zimmy]

thanks Raven, that may be the first time someone has referred to me as wise without a 3 letter reference to a back side.

[Raven]

even though i am not a big fan of Seals

the thought of a newly born pure white seal
1 minute old.......
laying on the ice in the artic where every thing seems so clean
and abundant

already has pesticides in its system....

that has changed my thinking in a major way...

the Earth and it's inhabitants have reached the saturation level
for toxins and pollutants... so it's everyones responsibility

to figure just how they can personally make a difference

besides recycling newspaper or soda cans or plastic

it's about doing things the old fashioned way before
companies like Monsanto came about and made us addicts
that have to use their crap...just to grow grass...

when DDT was outlawed in America the company just sold it
to South America and south America sells produce to America

[Raven]

and i understand the fishermans hatred of the animal
and it's perfectly justified

i'd go seal clubbing and splatter seal blood all over the ice any day
and leave them for the polar bears and artic fox to eat...

the point i was trying to make was about individual responsibility
when it comes to the obsession we americans have over the perfect lawn.

I used to watch this one idiot...walk out to his lawn every time a leaf
fell off his tree and pick that solitary leaf up over and over and over.

that's absolutely INSANE

not that i care really, but one of the reasons the Arabs hate us
is because of our insanity over growing grass..
and i can understand why......
i hate the stuff actually except for the fact it cools things down
and makes good compost.,& .mulch .........golf courses Suck!

i'd rather have IVY or clover or vegetables on my lawn instead.

but the fact remains using herbicides, insecticides, and other chemicals
is getting into everything even the nations children the same as anti depressents
are finding their way back into the drinking water in minute quantities
from flushing them down the magic toilet....bye bye pills...yeah right..
.like Arnold Swarzenager they are laughing at us saying "I'll be Back"

Now they are in the fish downstream ... too....

[Goose]

Arab's are jealous.
You make some very good points but its a little unrealistic. Some of the stuff you do is unconventional to say the least....cutting grass only before rain or wood ashes on grass etc. Don't get me wrong, just yesterday I spread ashes based on your advice only because I have it. I believe organic fertilizer cost 3 times more then the regular. There are lots of things people can do and should do to make this place better. IMO. Useing less would be fine, rather then going cold turkey.
I knooow I knooow ....you need every inch of your property to grow food because of the rising food costs.
How do you cut your grass...with a sickle?

[Raven]

Originally Posted by Goose

Arab's are jealous.
You make some very good points but its a little unrealistic. Some of the stuff you do is unconventional to say the least....cutting grass only before rain or wood ashes on grass etc. Don't get me wrong, just yesterday I spread ashes based on your advice only because I have it. I believe organic fertilizer cost 3 times more then the regular. There are lots of things people can do and should do to make this place better. IMO. Useing less would be fine, rather then going cold turkey.
I knooow I knooow ....you need every inch of your property to grow food because of the rising food costs.
How do you cut your grass...with a sickle?

i have an acre of grass to mow at present ( the riding lawn mower cost 150 bucks used) and i hope to keep reducing it like what Paul said in an earlier post... actually , when i said use wood ashes i was referring to using them in the garden as opposed to using them on the lawn... Lime can burn if over applied but ashes are a little less corrosive to plants...

I don't need every inch of land to grow food....but i'm hoping to do it as a business after i have satisfied all of our food requirements....i'm still eating frozen veggies from my last garden at my former residence ....remember the comment you made ...i believe it was you... saying you've got enough food to feed an Army...

Perhaps what i do IS unconventional Goose but i am Scottish and thus ultra thrifty by necessity... some people will walk by a dropped penny and i do too. I won't walk by a good washer or a bolt....and it goes in the drawer of spare parts for that rainy day.

[Goose]

What 'I' would do is have someone go there and check it out.
Ooor. If those spots have been washed out hit them with loam, plenty seed and starter fertilizer...don't forget to roll it. You don't need a spreader, throw the seed so it falls through your fingers while throwing, same with starter. Then keep moist. Home depot also sells easier products that are used to fill in spots,, just water. I have seen good results but never used it.

[Raven]

you have to scratch up those areas re seed and the roll it out again

another trick is to borrrow sod from the edges - you cut six inch strips with a very sharp edger and lay them across the bare spots
depending on how big they are of course , until they are filled in

and where you borrowed the grass it will fill itself back in fairly quick
if you keep that edge watered

but you always borrow from the areas where the grass seems to grow the easiest and lay it down where the grass seems difficult to grow.

[bloocrab]

Originally Posted by Raven

......another trick is to borrrow sod from the edges - you cut six inch strips with a very sharp edger and lay them across the bare spots.......

That was my plan for the larger spots, I have areas that I'll be mulching, and from those areas is where I'll pull my carpet from to fill in the big spots....but with the mini-bald spots ALL OVER the place, I guess I'm sprinkling loom and seed.

The steps I ass/ume I'll be taking.

1. spread the loom/fertilizer
2. seed the fertilized loom
3. roll the seeded fertilized loom
4. water the seeded fertilized loom
5. shoot all birds that land on watered seeded fertilized loom


Am I even remotely close???

[Raven]

but depending on the depth of the loam your about to add.....
you could sprinkle some grass seed down first and cover it
lightly with the loam and then roll it and sprinkle a little grass seed on top too....

the main objective is to get the grass seed in firm contact with the soil
and not have the sprouting grass seed dry out

for best germination you want to replant grass seed like 7 days
before the full moon which forces the water into the grass seed
via hydroscopic pressure ( it's highest at the full moon)
to achieve the highest germination rate possible

[bloocrab]

Is it too early in the season to do it now, should I wait for the fullness of the moon or warmer temps, Or just get err' done ASAP?

Also, When should spead the Lye on the Lawn??


Thanks in advance ~

[PRBuzz]

Don't put fertilizer with crabcrass preventer (Halts) down until 1st or 2nd week of May! I have done this for over 20 yrs and have no crabgrass in my lawn. Crabgrass doesn't sprout until ground temp reaches about 65dF plus the barrier only last 90 days, so if you put it too early you will have late season problems. Additionally the Halts chemical barrier should not be broken, i.e. by raking!

Put down a general fertilizer now to get lawn going and Halts in about 6 weeks. I buy 2 bags of Scotts Winterizer: one for Fall and one for Spring. Mine went down 3 weeks ago!

[Slingah]

Originally Posted by PRBuzz

Don't put fertilizer with crabcrass preventer (Halts) down until 1st or 2nd week of May! I have done this for over 20 yrs and have no crabgrass in my lawn. Crabgrass doesn't sprout until ground temp reaches about 65dF plus the barrier only last 90 days, so if you put it too early you will have late season problems. Additionally the Halts chemical barrier should not be broken, i.e. by raking!

Put down a general fertilizer now to get lawn going and Halts in about 6 weeks. I buy 2 bags of Scotts Winterizer: one for Fall and one for Spring. Mine went down 3 weeks ago!

man this lawn chit is for the birds....I guess you can't have new seed without crabgrass????? what am I missing here...

[PRBuzz]

Originally Posted by Slingah

man this lawn chit is for the birds....I guess you can't have new seed without crabgrass????? what am I missing here...

New seed is OK now as it will have more than enough time to germinate before crabgrass season in about 5 weeks.