This is one of those issues, even though some on here label me a 'radical' I can see both sides.

Is it a major impediment to getting or showing a picture ID. No. Does it impact some people? Probably

Do I think voter fraud is that rampant? No. Otherwise we'd see numbers (like records of all these dead people voting for a democrat...)

IMHO not a major panty-wadding issue.... both sides treat it that way though

probably never happens much and has no real impact if it does :)

April 9, 2012

The latest fraud case in Indiana shows how foolish the claim is that no election fraud exists or that it is “inconsequential.”

Four Democratic party officials, including the St. Joseph County chairman Butch Morgan, have been charged with conspiracy, forgery, and official misconduct in the 2008 presidential primary election. Morgan allegedly ordered three county officials to duplicate signatures from a 2008 petition for Democratic gubernatorial candidate Jim Schellinger onto petitions for then-presidential candidates Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama. The Republican member of the Board of Voter Registration’s signature, which is required for final authorization of all petitions, was apparently then rubber stamped without her knowledge. In Indiana, a candidate must secure 500 signatures from each of the state’s nine congressional districts in order to appear on the ballot. Then-senator Barack Obama barely qualified for the ballot with 534 signatures.

The South Bend Tribune collaborated with an independent political newsletter, Howey Politics Indiana, to conduct an investigation of the allegedly fake signatures. Erich Speckin, an expert forensic document analyst, told the paper that up to 270 of the ballot signatures for candidate Obama were fraudulent. “It’s obvious. It’s just terribly obvious” that the signatures on the various pages were made by the same hand, Speckin said after reviewing the documents. Previous investigations have already found no fewer than 150 fraudulent signatures on the petitions.

The fraud came to an end after a source from inside the county Democratic party who had participated personally in the scheme approached local investigators. Lucas Burkett attended meetings at the local Democratic party headquarters where Morgan ordered the forgeries. Investigators then compared the signatures on Obama and Clinton petitions to the signatures on file for registered voters, and contacted the voters whose names appeared on the forms, in order to confirm the signatures were forgeries.

Many common citizens were shocked and dismayed to see their own name and personal information on a petition they had supposedly signed four years earlier. “It’s scary. A lot of people have already lost faith in politics . . . and that solidifies our worries and concerns,” Mishawaka resident Charity Rorie.

There is no telling what other deceitful and illegal measures these local party officials were willing to take (or have taken in the past without detection) to steal an election. That is why we need to take steps throughout the voter registration, voting, and election process to secure the integrity of our elections. Voter ID is just one of the precautions necessary for a fair and honest vote.

Hans A. von Spakovsky is a senior legal fellow at the Heritage Foundation, a former FEC Commissioner, and the former counsel to the assistant attorney general for civil rights at the Justice Department.

Google's fun.

Does it happen, yes. On both sides, apparently
Is it rampant? I still say no.
BBCW: Voter Fraud Declared at Christian County, Missouri Republican Caucus: Rick Santorum Wins Fraudulent Caucus
Political Animal - Another GOP official commits election fraud

I guess..."Bungalow Bills"??? that's a good one :)

how many examples till we get to "rampant"?

Bry, did you actually read either of those?

Yes. One was a Caucus, the other was mostly making reference to voter suppression (albeit a creative approach) in Maryland.

So you see this is a major issue?
I'd much rather they tackle some campaign finance laws first. I think that's the more pressing issue.

I still want to know if Oqueef was dressed like a Pimp when he played Holder....

What, that the market has had perhaps one of it's best quarters ever?

-spence

[QUOTE=RIROCKHOUND;932803]Yes. One was a Caucus, the other was mostly making reference to voter suppression (albeit a creative approach) in Maryland.

So you see this is a major issue?
QUOTE]

we're talking about voter fraud and id's

and you post one story from an unusual website involving the Missouri caucus another about a republican whose voter registration showed his ex-wife's address(can't see how that could happen) and then a campaign manager that approved some robo calls which**, while annoying, if you actually believe a strange unnamed voice that calls your house at night and tells you not to bother voting...maybe you shouldn't be voting in the first place:uhuh:

and that's your evidence that there is either no evidence or that everyone does it so it's no big deal?

I thought we did tackle campaign finance laws?

**WashPo
Ex-Ehrlich campaign manager Schurick convicted in robocall case - The Washington Post

The jury convicted Schurick — who got his start in politics working for Democrats — of trying to influence votes through fraud,guess we know where he learned how:rotf2: failing to identify the source of the call as required by law and two counts of conspiracy to commit those crimes.

you are supposed to be keeping it over 13,000...get back to work:)

I had a kick a$$ meeting today with a huge global producer of hydrogen, oxygen and other industrial chemicals. Went really well...

Market still had a great quarter...suck it up.

-spence

But he didn't vote. Maybe she was setting him up to see if he voted and then was going to call the cops. So, he didn't vote and there is no voter fraud in this situation.:uhuh:

Is there a requirement in the constitution to have an id to vote:)

Interesting............................."The Constitution never explicitly ensures the right to vote, as it does the right to speech, for example. It does require that Representatives be chosen and Senators be elected by "the People," and who comprises "the People" has been expanded by the aforementioned amendments several times. Aside from these requirements, though, the qualifications for voters are left to the states. And as long as the qualifications do not conflict with anything in the Constitution, that right can be withheld. For example, in Texas, persons declared mentally incompetent and felons currently in prison or on probation are denied the right to vote. It is interesting to note that though the 26th Amendment requires that 18-year-olds must be able to vote, states can allow persons younger than 18 to vote, if they chose to."

yeah, that's probably what was going on....

Paul, if you have to work this hard making so little sense it should tell you something:)

you go girl...:claps:

I had a meeting last night just after dinner with a large producer of methane and it wasn't pretty :devil2:

Ok, you win. It was voter fraud even though no fraud occurred:rotf2:

Ya Spence, I figured you musta been on vacation. :)

you are the only one that claimed that he did anything wrong, noone said he committed voter fraud...just demonstrated that he could have...quite easily


Paul, if someone walked into your house, threw your dog a steak to preoccupy him and went to the jewellery in your bedroom and was about to take it but heard a noise outside and left...

I guess you'd claim that while he may have committed a crime(or lied in the voter case) by entering your house, he never actually took anything so there's no proof that he "could have" taken something if he'd wanted to and therefore any discussion of whether or not he could have taken your jewellery or the relative ease with which he could have taken it or the fact that he just walked into your house and so easily got by your guard dog has absolutely no bearing on the theftproofness/vunerability of your home....

and you might even claim that your dog was in fact "setting the burgular up" and while he appeared to be distracted and thoroughly enjoying the steak, he actually had on eye on the burgular and was planning to dial 911 as soon as he touched the goods ?

and finally..

"Ok, you win. It was theft even though no theft occurred:rotf2:"

which isn't really funny because noone claimed that a theft(voter fraud) occurred, we were just pointing out that it would be, based on the evidence, really easy to steal your jewellery, but you can't seem to grasp that.:)

and then imagine that rather than your home, we were talking about the home of the top home security consultant in America who had been for years claiming that home invasions in his neighborood and elsewhere were overstated:)

I told you Scott, you win. It was voter fraud. We need to change everything b/c there is wide spread voter fraud and b/c O'Keefe (I guess?) committed voter fraud. It says it in the constitution that everyone needs an ID and we need to get it done. - Is that good enough?

Make everyone show an ID.

As good old Benjamin Franklin once said “An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.”

Hell, back then only land owners could vote. Looking back its not a bad idea :)

“Unfortunately, the United States has a long history of voter fraud that has been documented by historians and journalists,” Supreme Court Justice John Paul Stevens wrote in 2008, upholding a strict Indiana voter-ID law designed to combat fraud. Justice Stevens, who personally encountered voter fraud while serving on various reform commissions in his native Chicago, spoke for a six-member majority. In a decision two years earlier clearing the way for an Arizona ID law, the Court had declared in a unanimous opinion that “confidence in the integrity of our electoral processes is essential to the functioning of our participatory democracy. Voter fraud drives honest citizens out of the democratic process and breeds distrust of our government. Voters who fear their legitimate votes will be outweighed by fraudulent ones will feel disenfranchised.”

Indeed, a brand-new Rasmussen Reports poll finds that 64 percent of Americans believe voter fraud is a serious problem, with whites registering 63 percent agreement and African-Americans 64 percent. A Fox News poll taken last month found that 70 percent of Americans support requiring voters to show “state or federally issued photo identification” to prove their identity and citizenship before casting a ballot. Majorities of all demographic groups agreed on the need for photo ID, including 58 percent of non-white voters, 52 percent of liberals, and 52 percent of Democrats.





Artur Davis, who was a Democratic congressman from Alabama until last year. Davis has been an up-and-coming black Democratic leader, having been selected to second the nomination of Barack Obama at the 2008 Democratic convention in Denver.

But in 2009 he decided to vote against Obamacare because he viewed it as unworkable and too expensive. When he ran the next year in the Democratic primary for governor in Alabama, he was attacked as disloyal and defeated by a coalition of liberals, teachers’ unions, and old-style black political machines.

He told me that the voter suppression he most observed in his 68 percent African-American district was rampant fraud in counties with powerful political machines. To keep themselves in power, these machines would frequently steal the votes of members of minority groups. “I know it exists, I’ve had the chance to steal votes in my favor offered to me, and the people it hurts the most are the poor and those without power,” he said.

Davis made it clear in his speech to True the Vote that much of the opposition to voter-ID and ballot-integrity laws is a sad attempt to inject racism into the discussion and intimidate supporters of anti-fraud laws. “This is not a billy club, this is not a fire hose,” he told his audience while holding up his driver’s license. “Where is this notion that if I have a right [to vote], that I don’t have to be bothered with responsibility?” He concluded with an appeal for all sides to eschew racial appeals: “We have to be one country, but the way you become one country is you stop acting like a country that’s divided into different buckets and bases of people.”

Slow day at the B&T?

Ah, a man with common sense. I'd vote for him in a second.
Too bad he wasn't running against Obama in the 08 primary, oh that's right
he couldn't win, he's not a mind reader.