The White House offered a one-year amnesty to companies. Meaning, companies could sign up for Obamacare if they wished to, but they would not be penalized for not signing up.

The GOP is asking that individuals get the same break. How is that unfair, particularly in light of the fact, the irrefutable fact, that most people cannot enroll even if they try to, because the system doesn't work? Are you OK with getting fined, because the administration couldn't connect a server?

And I thought liberals liked to get worked up about not putting the interests of corporations above those of the individual? Isn't that what the whole Occupy Wall Street movement was about? All the liberals supported them. Seems to me, that what the GOP is asking for, is exactly in line with the agenda of the Occupy Wall Street (that, and they wanted to be able to poop in the park, and to sack/pillage all surrounding businesses like the Vikings, but I digress).

It takes two to shut down. All Obama had to do, was be willing to give individuals the same break he was giving to Big Business. I would have thought Obama was OK with that notion.

Taxes and revenue continue to come in at record levels .
This is all BS and Constitutionally it's impossible to default.
I hope the few people in congress that are truly looking out for our future hold fast !
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Funny, the majority of the population doesn't feel that way and is blaming the Repubs. much more than the Dems. Is extortion a way to negotiate?

When your doing the right thing , you don't worry about what's in it for you.
Explain your last comment ? I'm confused
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Wow, you've drank A LOT of Kool-Aid.

Buck, the Tea Party is holding the entire country hostage. Bohner has lost control and the PACs are openly threatenening any Republicans who plays ball.

The proposed House Bill that imploded yesterday was more about gaining talking points on the HCB than striking a deal.

Bohner and Cantor need to rally and quick.

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Explain how I'm wrong. Something like 200 billion coming in each month and like 20 billion in interest per month needs to be paid to prevent a default. That 20 billion has to be paid unless the President illegally orders the treasuries not to pay it . I believe that's how it works but your clearly the expert so learn me ;)
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First off, our total interest outlays are a lot more than 20 B a month, it's like 400 B for the entire year.

Second, you still have the fund the other 80% still running or the economy implodes. We don't keep all that much cash under the mattress.
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So your saying we can pay the dept but the rest is unsustainable on the income we generate , which at its current level is higher then ever before .
Sounds like your coming around.
Might even make you wonder how this can work if the dept hits 20 trillion by 2016 ,as projected ,
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Oh yea, I'm coming around :rolleyes:

How does that equation look with a recession and less cashflow?
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...ty-rift-video/

Paul, you are correct that polls show that most blame the GOP. That doesn't make me wrong, when I say that (1) what the GOP is asking for, is not unreasonable, and that (2) Obama c ould have avoided the shutdown by agreeing to their reasonable demands.

Paul, a simple question...do YOU think it's unreasonable for the GOP to ask that Obama give the same break to individuals that he is giving to companies, especially since individuals cannot sign up even if they wanted to? Yes or no?

"Is extortion a way to negotiate?"

Funny. When the Wisconsin legialature was going to reduce union benefits, and all the Dems in the state senate fled the state to halt the vote, I don't recall all this backlash against them. In Texas, when that Democratic state rep fillibustered for 24 hours to prevent an anti-abortion bill, she was hailed as a hero. When democrate are in the minority, I keep heraing that "dissent is the highest form of patriotism". When a black Democrat is in the white house, dissent is racist and extortion. IS that what you're saying?

I don't like the shutdown. I particularly don't like it when our petty, vindictive President goes to unimaginable lengths to make it as painful as possible for WWII vets and families of those killed in action. If you're OK with Obama's actions there, that's your right. But those actions are a betrayal of the most basic duties of his office. He's a disgrace.

Looks like my kid should start mandarin classes soon
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The future if we keep kicking the can down the road as you prefer to do .
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So you want to pick and choose what should stay open or what aspects of the govern. should stay in force? Did the Pres. specifically do something to prevent the benefits paid to those families or are they not being paid bc of the lack of action of Repub. lead House?

Quite seriously
 

i have ALIEN DNA

from those in the star system Sirius

therefore i am considered multi species human/alien :uhuh:

"Did the Pres. specifically do something to prevent the benefits paid"

Yes, he did. He chose not to sign an Executive Order to demand those payments be made. That was within his authority to do, and he chose not to do it. It's unbelievably cruel, an unthinkable betrayal.

"There was plenty of backlash. I'm sure you even started threads about it"

PaulS, here is my point, and read slowly because it's a valid point...there was no backlash from your side. There is only backlash when conservatives act like brats.

Paul, I answered your points. You, on the other hand, completely dodged a very simple yes or no question that I asked. So I'll ask it again. Please show me the same courtesy that I showed you, and answer my question, which is as follows...

do YOU think it's unreasonable for the GOP to ask that Obama give the same break to individuals that he is giving to companies, especially since individuals cannot sign up even if they wanted to? Yes or no?

"Who, other than you said it was racism?"

OK Paul. Now you are saying that no one claims that those who oppose Obama, do so because of racism? No one has said that? No one in Washington, no one in the media, not Jimmy Carter? No one has called the Tea Party racist? Obama himself, didn't say that the McCain campaign was going to try and make people afraid of the fact that he's black? Obama didn't say that?

Google it yourself if you can't be bothered to answer one yes/no question that I asked...

Paul, here is what then-canbdidate Obam asaid about John McCain in 2008...

"We know what kind of campaign they’re going to run,” said the presumptive Democratic presidential nominee. “They’re going to try to make you afraid. They’re going to try to make you afraid of me. ‘He’s young and inexperienced and he’s got a funny name. And did I mention he’s black?’"

McCain is a decent guy, a war hero who made unthinkable sacrifices for his country. He was generous enough to adopt a BLACK GIRL FROM A THIRD WORLD COUNTRY, and your hero said McCain was a racist.

When McCain didn't run a racist campaign, did Obama apologize? Did he admit he was wrong? Nope.

Have fun with that...

NM

I don't the Obama coulda have done anything on death benefits via executive order without Congressional approval. Just because he's POTUS doesn't mean he can spend money illegally. They either had to do it via legislation or as they ended up doing through an outside channel.

To say this was cruel is a silly vain attempt to create a division between the Commander in Chief and the troops just to score a few political points. That on it's own is pathetic.

By this is the GOP we have today, nothing is too costly if it reinforces the dream world some Republicans appear to be living in.
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Redo in 3 months . Cowards .
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House still has to pass it.

But even then were just going to get another LSD inspired push to defund the HCB that's never going to happen...instead of some actual negotiation.
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Paul -

Twice, I asked you a very simple yes or no question. Both times you dodged. If my beliefs were so flimsy, that I could get boxed into a corner with such a simple yes/no question, I would take a long, hard look at why I believe what I believe.

I'll leave it at that.

"I don't the Obama coulda have done anything on death benefits via executive order without Congressional approval."

Then you would be 100% wrong. That's what an executive order, something the executive can order, unilaterally. Spence, you need to get in the habit of getting some facts before you spout off that your hero is innocent.

"To say this was cruel is a silly vain attempt "

Tell that to the families. Like your ghero, you are unable to put yourself in their shoes, because like your hero, you have nohting but disdain for them. If you don't htink that denying death benefits, when he could have restored them with a stroke of the pen, is cruel, that's your right.

It was the denial of benefits, and the barricading of open-air parks, which was a pathetic, vain attempt to score political points. And clearly it worked on you.

Get some facts, before you invent pro-Obama jibberish. Executive Orders. Look it up.

" They either had to do it via legislation "

Wrong on the facts. Google "Obama Executive Order", and you'll see that he has signed a few, which reults in money getting spent on things he wants, without legislative approval. Or maybe try enrolling in a high school civics class before invent pro-Obama fantasies...

It was about $3 million in benefits that he denied. Less than he spends on one of his many, typical, czar-like vacations. Nice!

Is LSD covered ?
I would be wiling to bet Obama and friends are more likely to have experimented then Cruz and company ;)
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Show me an executive order that spends money not already approved by another mechanism.

Show me some real analysis that the exec order was legal and at his disposal.

I believe the DoD already did a legal review and told the WH congressional action would be required for the money to come through the normal channel.
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If I asked you do you still beat your wife and said that you had to answer with a simple yes or no, would (or could) you?

If it wasn't we have a single payer health care system now.
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Apples and oranges. Read slowly and you'll seee why...

(1) I don't beat my wife

(2) The GOP is, in fact, asking Obama to treat individuals the same way he's treating businesses.

Yours was a trick question. Mine was not.

And you should go back and read my initial response.

How come when I say "he could have restored payments with executive order", you ask for proof. But when you say "I believe the DoD already did a legal review and told the WH congressional action would be required", you want us to take your word? Why is that?

In any event, here is an executive order signed buy Obama, to increase the scope and mission of Homeland Security. It invlilved increased funding.

http://www.examiner.com/article/obam...ission-the-u-s